Discussion Notes re: William Glover Ancestry

This page is for discussion...no arguments...just trying between folks that have common descendants to get to the bottom of things. Any relevant information will be posted here and hopefully between us , we arrive at a solution. You are welcome to email me here

Original information from your Emails...Veronica ([email protected] ) (rec'd 2010)


"The following is the info I have , some of it came from a very large tree Glover /Ashton. Wllm b abt 1756 Dalton to a John Glover b 1732 & Eliz Corless m Upholland 1750.
John son of William b 1702 Ashton m Ellen Garner 1726 Winwick.
Wllm b 1702 son of William.
Children of Wllm & Ellen . Ann , John,Jane,Mgt Richard & Henry.
Children of John & Elizabeth, William Thomas Jane & Mgt.
Ann daughter of Wllm married Richard Ashton 1742
Thomas brother of Hugh had a daughter Ellen m Thomas Ashton descendant
of Richard nearly 100 years later.
Noticed you have Wlliam's birth 1745.Looking back through my paper work I thought you may be interested in the following which I received 1999 from a John Glover living in Rainford now died I believe.
Thomas G had a son Henry b1676/78 m sarah potter 1702.
Children Alexander, Thomas,, John, Henry ,John ,Alice ,Sarah ,Mary.
Thomas b 1706 Rainhill married Deborah Rigby 1729 children Thomas, Henry, James, John, Michael , William 1746 who married Ruth Sefton."


(Chris) This would provide the following 2 trees.....

 

We do know that a William Glover married Ruth Sephton

Marriage: 2 Oct 1773 All Saints, Rainford, Lancashire, England
William Glover - Husbandman of Rainford in the Parish of Prescot
Ruth Sephton - (X), Spinster of Rainford in the Parish of Prescot
Witness: Hugh Sephton; James Spencer
Married by Banns by: Richd. Hunt Minister
Register: Marriages 1772 - 1793, Page 8, Entry 31
Source: LDS Film 1657567

To have married in 1773 he must at least have been (say) 17 thus would have been born about 1756 or earlier, But at this stage does not indicate who was his father.

From baptism(christening) records on OPC there are at least 3 William Glovers that may fit this time scale....

Baptisms: 31 Aug 1746 St Peter and St Paul, Ormskirk, Lancashire, England
William Glover - Son of Thomas Glover & Deborah
Abode: Lath[om]
Register: Baptisms 1743 - 1770, Page 12, Entry 7
Source: LDS Film 1849663Baptisms: 6 Jun 1756 St Thomas the Martyr, Up Holland, Lancashire, England

William Glover - Son of John Glover
Abode: Upholland
Occupation: Weaver
Register: Baptisms 1735 - 1767, Page 37, Entry 24
Source: LDS Film 1657531Baptisms: 12 Oct 1768 St Mary the Virgin, Prescot, Lancashire, England

William Glover - Son of Thomas Glover & Elizabeth
Born: 15 Sep 1768
Abode: Rainhill
Occupation: Watchmaker
Register: Baptisms 1766 - 1809, Page 11, Entry 4
Source: LDS Film 1657583 item 8

In our case I believe the 3rd can be discounted which leaves our William as either son of Thomas and Debs or son of John & Liz from Upholland. At this stage in the discussion...I think either are plausable, and neither proved. However in 1773 at the time of the marriage there are infact 2x William Glovers in the area.

Which gives..

Willam Glover b. 1746 son of Thomas and Deborah of Lathom

William Glover b.1756 son of John Glover of Upholland

Although William had a son called Thomas (b. 1775) I would like to have seen a Deborah there as well amongst his children. However to add to the confusion he also had a son named John !

The map confirms that both possiblities are equally plausable.

Further Confusion

Baptisms: 31 Aug 1746 St Peter and St Paul, Ormskirk, Lancashire, England
William Glover - Son of Thomas Glover & Deborah
Abode: Lath[om]
Register: Baptisms 1743 - 1770, Page 12, Entry 7
Source: LDS Film 1849663

Baptisms: 26 Feb 1758 St Peter and St Paul, Ormskirk, Lancashire, England
Alice Glover - Daughter of Thomas Glover & Mary
Notes: Baptised at Lathom Chappell
Register: Baptisms 1743 - 1770, Page 45, Entry 18
Source: LDS Film 1849663

Also there was more than 1 Thomas Glover in Lathom.

 

Burial: 9 Jun 1763 St Peter and St Paul, Ormskirk, Lancashire, England
Deborah Glover - Daughter of Thomas Glover
Abode: Lath(om)
Register: Burials 1743 - 1771, Page 51, Entry 11
Source: LDS Film 1849663

Baptisms: 9 Sep 1769 Douglas Chapel, Eccleston, Lancashire, England
Deborah Glover - daughter of Thomas Glover & Mary
Abode: Parbold
Occupation: Husbandman
Register: Baptisms 1760 - 1781, Page 35, Entry 2
Source: LDS Film 1526114

Burial: 4 Jun 1770 St Peter and St Paul, Ormskirk, Lancashire, England
Deborah Glover - Daughter of Thomas Glover
Abode: Parbold
Register: Burials 1743 - 1771, Page 70, Entry 35
Source: LDS Film 1849663

The Thomas Glover that married Deborah Rigby was a watch tool maker from Rainhill...viz

Marriage: 9 Feb 1729/30 St Mary the Virgin, Prescott, Lancashire, England
Thomas Glover - Watch toole maker of Rainhill
Deborah Rigby - spinster of Cronton
Married by Banns
Register: Marriages 1727 - 1753, Page 122, Entry 65
Source: LDS Film 1657583 item 7

and as such I think can be ruled out altogether.

This leaves us only with John Glover..as the father of William, the Upholland weaver, a place to which descendant repeatly return to...

The John Glover Story

Name: John Glover
Gender: Male
Spouse's name: Elizabeth Corles
Marriage Date: 11 Feb 1750
Marriage Place: Upholland, Lancashire, England
There are the following children..

Children

 

Baptisms: 16 Feb 1752 St Thomas the Martyr, Up Holland, Lancashire, England
Thomas Glover - Son of John Glover
Abode: Upholland
Occupation: Weaver
Register: Baptisms 1735 - 1767, Page 29, Entry 4
Source: LDS Film 1657531

Baptisms: 4 Dec 1753 St Thomas the Martyr, Up Holland, Lancashire, England
Jane Glover - Daughter of John Glover
Abode: Upholland
Occupation: Weaver
Notes: Baptized privately and admitted Feb 17 following
Register: Baptisms 1735 - 1767, Page 33, Entry 21
Source: LDS Film 1657531

Baptisms: 6 Jun 1756 St Thomas the Martyr, Up Holland, Lancashire, England
William Glover - Son of John Glover
Abode: Upholland
Occupation: Weaver
Register: Baptisms 1735 - 1767, Page 37, Entry 24
Source: LDS Film 1657531

This could very well be our William...what do you think?

Baptisms: 17 Apr 1758 St Thomas the Martyr, Up Holland, Lancashire, England
Margaret Glover - Daughter of John Glover
Abode: Upholland
Occupation: Weaver
Register: Baptisms 1735 - 1767, Page 40, Entry 19
Source: LDS Film 1657531

Burial: 23 Mar 1759 St Thomas the Martyr, Up Holland, Lancashire, England
Margaret Glover - Daughter of John Glover
Abode: Upholland
Occupation: Weaver
Register: Burials 1735 - 1768, Page 1, Entry 20
Source: LDS Film 1657531

Sadly Margaret died less than 1 year old.

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Of the John Glovers born in Lancashire 1730 + or- 10 years we have...


Baptisms: 4 Sep 1726 St Mary the Virgin, Prestwich, Lancashire, England
John Glover - Son of Edward Glover & Mary
Abode: Hartswell
Occupation: Linnen Weaver
Register: Baptisms 1712 - 1752, Page 32, Entry 8
Source: LDS Film 2113204

Baptisms: 23 Apr 1732 St Thomas, Ashton in Makerfield, Lancashire, England
John Glover - son of William Glover
Born: 4 Apr 1732
Register: Baptisms 1698 - 1764, Page 73, Entry 19
Source: FHL British Film 1885657

Baptisms: 16 Mar 1734/5 St Peter and St Paul, Ormskirk, Lancashire, England
John Glover - Son of Jos. Glover & Ann
Abode: Lath[om]
Register: Baptisms 1679 - 1699, Page 97, Entry 102
Source: LDS Film 1849663

Baptisms: 10 Sep 1738 St Wilfrid, Farnworth near Prescot, Lancashire, England
John Glover - Son of Alexander Glover
Abode: Sutton
Register: Baptisms 1728 - 1743, Page 21, Entry 5
Source: LDS Film 1655234 item 1

Baptisms: 29 Aug 1740 St Mary the Virgin, Prestwich, Lancashire, England
John Glover - Son of Peter Glover
Abode: Thatchleach
Occupation: Weaver
Register: Baptisms 1712 - 1752, Page 81, Entry 27
Source: LDS Film 2113204

Of these, perhaps only 1 matches our John glover ??¿

As records from this time are often incomplete I believe that it is impossible to make a definitive conclusion, though at this stage I think that Upholland John as the Father of our William Glover is certainly a prime suspect!

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14/03/2010 (Chris)

At this stage we are still unsure of Williams Fathers' name

I did find this record that jumped out at me..

Marriage: 14 Jul 1735 All Saints, Childwall, Lancashire, England
Hugh Glover & Hannah Potter,
both of Prescot, licence IGI.....Possibly a red herring!

Looking at this from a different angle, I noticed that James Spencer was witness at the marriage of William G. and Ruth Sephton.1773..so was he also witness to any of his other brothers/sisters marriages ?.. which may point to Williams heritage...

Marriage: 19 Nov 1764 All Saints, Rainford, Lancashire, England
John Case - of Whiston
Ellen Glover - (X), of Rainhill
Witness: Edmand Bispham; Jas. Spencer
Married by Banns by: Ed. Jones Licensed Minister
Register: Marriages 1761 - 1772, Entry 72
Source: LDS Film 1657567

Marriage: 19 Sep 1768 All Saints, Rainford, Lancashire, England
William Glover - Staymaker of Prescot
Anne Pollock - Spinster of Prescot
Witness: Ann Parr; James Spencer
Married by Banns by: Richd. Hunt Minr.
Register: Marriages 1761 - 1772, Entry 139
Source: LDS Film 1657567

Marriage: 15 Jan 1772 All Saints, Rainford, Lancashire, England
Michael Bibby - Husbandman of Eccleston
Mary Glover - (X), Spinster of Parr
Witness: John Glover; John Owen; James Spencer
Married by Banns by: Richd. Hunt Minr.
Register: Marriages 1761 - 1772, Entry 215
Source: LDS Film 1657567

Marriage: 16 Oct 1780 All Saints, Rainford, Lancashire, England
Richard Gore - Husbandman Bachelor of Of this Parish
Ellen Glover - (X), Spinster of Of this Parish
Witness: Peter Glover; James Spencer
Married by Banns by: Math. Robinson Minister
Register: Marriages 1772 - 1793, Page 45, Entry 184
Source: LDS Film 1657567

chasing back then through the baptism records of these Glovers, assuming that they married aged (about 20) I think only 1 comes close...

Baptisms: 16 Oct 1757 St Peter and St Paul, Ormskirk, Lancashire, England
Ellin Glover - Daughter of Henry Glover & Mary
Abode: Lath[om]
Register: Baptisms 1743 - 1770, Page 42, Entry 31
Source: LDS Film 1849663

Baptisms: ? Mar 1762 New Chapel Baldwin St, St Helens, Lancashire, England
Ellen Glover - Daughter of James Glover
Abode: St. Hellens
Register: Baptisms 1734 - 1770, Page 13, Entry 7

 

So now we have also a Henry Glover from Lathom, was Ellin a cousin or a sister, or not related at all. But as William didn't have children named Henry or Mary I doubt that he is their son.

I am beginning to think that there were so many Glovers in the area at the time (probably all related) but without more complete information available, especially with some records missing, it is going to be almost impossible to join the correct dots.

 

Comments and input are most welcome.