79849964. Sir Henry de Hastings
1Carl Boyer 3d, Medieval English Ancestors of Certain Americans (Santa Clarita, CA 2000), 48.
2Carl Boyer, 3rd, Medieval English Ancestors of Robert Abell (Carl Boyer, 3rd, P.O. Box 220333, Santa Clarita, CA 91322-0333), 136.
79849965. Lady Joan de Cantelou
1Frederick Lewis Weis, Ancestral Roots of Certain American Colonists (Genealogical Publishing Co., Baltimore, MD, 7th Ed, 1999), 93A-28.
2Carl Boyer, 3rd, Medieval English Ancestors of Robert Abell (Carl Boyer, 3rd, P.O. Box 220333, Santa Clarita, CA 91322-0333), 136.
3Cokayne, Complete Peerage (Sutton Publishing, 2000 ed.), 6:346.
79849984. Sir William d'Evereux
1Carl Boyer, 3rd, Medieval English Ancestors of Robert Abell (Carl Boyer, 3rd, P.O. Box 220333, Santa Clarita, CA 91322-0333), 86.
79849985. Lady Maud Gifford
1Carl Boyer, 3rd, Medieval English Ancestors of Robert Abell (Carl Boyer, 3rd, P.O. Box 220333, Santa Clarita, CA 91322-0333), 86.
79850032. Richard de la Bere
1Carl Boyer, 3rd, Medieval English Ancestors of Robert Abell (Carl Boyer, 3rd, P.O. Box 220333, Santa Clarita, CA 91322-0333), 23.
79850244. Sir John de Muscegros
1Frederick Lewis Weis, Ancestral Roots of Certain American Colonists (Genealogical Publishing Co., Baltimore, MD, 7th Ed, 1999), 189-3.
2Frederick Lewis Weis, Ancestral Roots of Certain American Colonists, 189-3.
79850245. Lady Cecily Avenal
1Medieval Genealogy Newsgroup.
<snip> 1. Sir Robert de Muscegros; b. before 1252; d. 27 December 1280.
"From: G . EDWARD ALLEN ([email protected])
Subject: Re: Muscegros- Bures
Newsgroups: soc.genealogy.medieval
Date: 1998/12/07
2. Sir john de Muscegros of Charlton; b. 10 August 1232; d. 8 May 1275.
3. Cecily Avenal; d. 10 August 1301.
4. Sir Robert de Muscegros, of Charlton, Somerset; d. shortly before 29
January 1253/54; md. before 11 February 1220/21.
5. Hawise Malet of Curry Malet, Somerset.
6. Sir William Avenel; b. ca. Nov. 1202; d. 21 April 1236.
7. Aline.
10. Sir William malet of Curry malet, Somerset; d. ca. 1216.
11. Alice Basset of Headington. This is from AR, line 189. 8. Richard de Muscegros ;b. before 1200; d. after 1239.
9. Alice Dyve.
16. Richard de Muscegros; d. ca. 1200.
17. Hilary Folet. Houghton. "The Family of Muchgros." Trans. Birmingham Archaeological
Soc., xlvii (1921). 6. William Avenel of English Bicknor, Gloucs.; d. 1236.
12. Ralph Avenel; d. after 1190.
13. Margaret; d. before 1236.
24. Ralph Avenel of Sandhurst, Gloucs.; d. after 1174.
48. Robert Avenel of Sandhurst; d. after 1167. Woodward MSS, Society of Genealogists, London which cites Bristol &
Gloucs. Arch. Soc. Trans. iv:313. Kay Allen AG [email protected]."2Frederick Lewis Weis, Ancestral Roots of Certain American Colonists (Genealogical Publishing Co., Baltimore, MD, 7th Ed, 1999), line 189-3.
79850296. Sir Thomas de Weyland
1Medieval Genealogy Newsgroup.
Dear Rosie, Douglas, et al., Two sources of information have raised issues as to both the ancestry of
"From: [email protected] ([email protected]
Subject: de Weyland, an Irish Connection (?) : Chipping Sodbury, co. Glocs.
Newsgroups: soc.genealogy.medieval
Date: 2002-05-28 12:00:58 PST
Tuesday, 28 May, 2002
the issue of Sir Thomas de Weyland, one-time Lord Chief Justice of the King's
Bench (d. in exile, 1291 or later), and the exact line of descent from Sir
Thomas to Cecily de Weyland, heiress of her father (Sir Richard) and wife of
Bartholomew de Burghersh, Lord Burghersh (d. 1369). The first source, alleging that the Weyland or Welond family 'had been
the original Anglo-Norman grantees' of Tulachrothan and other lands in
Ireland, states as follows: ' 1283 (Quinzaine of St. Martin). Final concord
made in the King's court at Westminster, in the
quinzaine of St. Martin, a. r. 12, before John
de Lobetot, Roger of Leicester, and William de
Burnton, justices between Thomas Welond, Margery
his wife, Richard their son, complainants, and
William le Gras, deforciant, whereby a plea of
agreement was made between them, to wit, that
the said William acknowledged the manor of
Sobbit (i.e. Sodbbury) to be the right of the
said Richard to hold to the said Thomas,
Margery, and Richard, and the heirs body of
Richard, of the lords of the fee for ever;
with reversion in fee to John, son of Thomas
Welond, after Thomas's and Margery's death, if
Richard should have no heirs of his body.
Warranty by William; and for this acknowledge-
ment, warranty, fine and concord, the said
Thomas granted in exchange to the said William
all the lands, & c., which William previously
had of the gift of William Welond, Thomas's
brother, in Tulachrothan, Rathbolgan,
Gurtuelem and Balydine, Ireland, to hold to
the said William le Gras in fee; paying 1d.
at Easter, and rendering for Thomas to the
chief lords of the fee all other services
belonging to the said tenements in Ireland.
Warranty of the tenements in Ireland by
Thomas and his heirs to the said William le
Gras.' [1] Evidently the Weyland family in fact had established rights in Ireland,
to which Sir Thomas was heir, but over which there was some dispute. Sir
Thomas had (according to Copinger) inherited the Suffolk manors of the family
at Brandeston, Westerfield & c. from his elder brother William, who d. in
1274 (shortly after their father, Sir John). This is the first indication I
have seen of such a connection between the Weyland family and tenancies in Ireland. <snip> Thomas de Weyland is given by Copinger as having wed Margaret de Moese, daughter and heiress of Thomas de Moese, of Campsey, Suffolk. Outside of the Weyland and Moese surnames, and the various manors held by those families as identified by Copinger (Brandeston, Westerfield & c.) no earlier family connections have been ascertained. <snip>."
79850297. Lady Margaret de Moese
1Medieval Genealogy Newsgroup.
Dear Rosie, Douglas, et al., <snip> Thomas de Weyland is given by Copinger as having wed Margaret de Moese, daughter and heiress of Thomas de Moese, of Campsey, Suffolk. Outside of the Weyland and Moese surnames, and the various manors held by those families as identified by Copinger (Brandeston, Westerfield & c.) no earlier family connections have been ascertained. <snip>."
"From: [email protected] ([email protected]
Subject: de Weyland, an Irish Connection (?) : Chipping Sodbury, co. Glocs.
Newsgroups: soc.genealogy.medieval
Date: 2002-05-28 12:00:58 PST
Tuesday, 28 May, 2002
79850298. Sir Richard de Braiose lord of Wingfield
1Medieval Genealogy Newsgroup.
This is an all new Magna Carta descent which may interest many people here on the medieval newsgroup. This line will be featured in the forthcoming book, Magna Carta Ancestry. Best always, Douglas Richardson, Salt Lake City, Utah, and Dr. David
"From: [email protected]
Subject: New MC Line: Clare-Breuse-Weyland-Burghersh-Despenser
Newsgroups: soc.genealogy.medieval
Date: 2000-12-25 22:00:05 PST
Faris, Philadelphia, Pennsylvania 1. Richard de Clare, Earl of Hertford, Magna Carta Baron, married Amice
of Gloucester, daughter of William Fitz Robert, 2nd Earl of Gloucester. 2. Maud de Clare, married William de Breuse (died 1210), Baron of
Bramber, Sussex. 3. John de Breuse (died 1232), Baron of Bramber, Sussex, married
Margaret of North Wales, daughter of Llywelyn ap Iowerth, Prince of
North Wales. 4. Sir Richard de Breuse (died 1292), of Stinton in Salle, Norfolk,
married Alice le Rus. 5. Mary de Breuse, married in or before 1288 (date of fine) to John de
Weyland (died 1312), of Blaxhall, Ashbocking, etc., Suffolk. 6. Sir Richard de Weyland (died 1319), of Blaxhall, Rouse Hall in
Clopton, Suffolk, married Joan _____. 7. Cecily de Weyland, daughter and sole heiress, married before 10 May
1335, Sir Bartholomew de Burghersh, 4th Lord Burghersh. The following immigrants descend from Cecily (de Weyland) de Burghersh
above: 1. Robert Abell."
79850299. Lady Alice le Rus
1Medieval Genealogy Newsgroup.
The following 8 generation ancestor list for Alice le Rus includes the
"From: Richard Borthwick ([email protected])
Subject: re: Clere/Fay/Rus/Turnham
Newsgroups: soc.genealogy.medieval
View: (This is the only article in this thread) | Original Format
Date: 1999/02/08
conjecture that the Fay family was a branch of the Chatellerault. '#'
indicates that the affiliation of the person so marked is conjectural.
There is more on the Turnham family which I have not yet accessed. 1 Alice LE RUS. Born 1245/1247. Died Before 28 Jan 1301. Buried in
Woodbridge Priory. Occupation Heir to Stinton, Norf; Akenham &
Whittingham, Suffolk.
Alice was heir of her father.
[CP II:304; VCH Yorks (NR) II:490; VCH Surrey III:83; HKF III:357, 440;
EYC I:481]
She married Sir Richard de BREWES, of Stinton, Norf, Before 9 Sep 1265.
2 William # LE RUS, of Stinton, Norf. Died 1253.
Farrer thinks it likely that William was younger brother of Hugh (II)
(d.1232) and his heir.
[CP II:304; VCH Yorks (NR) II:490; VCH Surrey III:83; HKF III:357, 438,
439-441; EYC I:481]
He married Agatha de CLERE.
3 Agatha de CLERE. Died Before 1250.
Agatha was heir of her parents.
[CP II:304; VCH Yorks (NR) II:490; VCH Surrey III:83; HKF III:357, 438,
439; EYC I:481]
4 Hugh (I) LE RUS, of Woodbridge & Stradbrook. Died 1230.
[HKF III:439]
6 Sir Roger (III) de CLERE, of Sinnington, Shere & Bramley. Died 1248.
Roger passed by fine to John fitz Geoffrey the manor of Shere.
[CP II:304; VCH Yorks (NR) II:490; HKF III:356-357; EYC I:481]
He married Maud de FAY, Before 1232.
7 Maud de FAY. Died 1249.
Maud was elder sister and heir of John de Fay (d.1241). A pedigree
published in *The Genealogist* (Old Series) V:318 alleges (wrongly) that
William de Braose (d.1210) grandfather of William and Richard (husband Maud
de Fay's granddaughter and heir) was the first husband of Maud de Fay.
Maud survived her husband. His death is variously given as 1248, 1249 or
1250. Maud herself was dead by 1250 when the wardship of her granddaughter
in Maud's lands in Sinnington were granted to William le Rus.
[VCH Yorks (NR) II:490; VCH Surrey III:82, 83; HKF III:356-357; EYC I:481]
8 Ernald (III) LE RUS, of Stradbrook & Akenham. Died 1215.
[HKF III:438-439]
12 Ralph (II) de CLERE, Sinnington & Shere. Died After 1232.
[VCH Yorks (NR) II:490; HKF III:356; EYC I:481]
14 Ralph de FAY, of Bramley, Surrey. Died 1223.
Bramley was restored to this Ralph after the accession of king John.
[HKF II:109, III:356-357; VCH Surrey III:4, 53, 82]
He married Beatrice de TURNEHAM.
15 Beatrice de TURNEHAM. Died Before 1246.
Beatrice was coheir of her father.
[HKF II:109, III:356-357; VCH Surrey III:4, 5, 53, 84]
16 Ernald (II) LE RUS, of Stradbrook. Died After 1166.
Ernald held Stradbrook in 1159 but not thereafter.
[HKF III:438]
24 Ralph (I) de CLERE, of Wilton, Shere & Sinnington. Died 1205.
Ralph was heir of his brother Roger (II) (d.1183/84). Roger (II) is
described as 'Roger son of Roger'. Hence Ralph was also son of Roger (I).
VCH Yorks (NR) II:490; HKF III:355-356; EYC I:480]
He married Mabel.
25 Mabel.
In the Fine Roll Mabel is described as 'Mabilia Edmundi'.
[VCH Yorks (NR) II:490; HKF III:356; EYC I:480]
28 Ralph # [ =? Raoul de FAYE] de FAY, of Bramley, Surrey. Died Before 1210.
Ralph the elder was granted Bramley and other fees by king Henry II.
Ralph was dispossessed for his part in the rebellion of the young Henry and
it would appear that while he did recover some lands after king Henry's
death, he did not recover Bramley. There is a conjecture that this Ralph de
Fay is to be identified with Raoul de Faye, lord of Faye-la-Vineuse, first
cousin of queen Eleanor, consort of king Henry II. The references below
give no evidence to support this conjecture. The dates given in ES for
Raoul fit what we know of Ralph's dates, but ES indicates no descendants
for Raoul.
[VCH Surrey III:53, 82; ES III/4:813]
30 Stephen de TURNEHAM, of Great Berwick, Salop. Died 1214.
Stephen was the king's mashal.
[HKFI:24, III:69, 71, 182-183, 356; VCH Surrey III:4, 84]
He married Edeline de BROC, L of Angmering.
31 Edeline de BROC, L of Angmering. Died 1221.
Eveline or Edeline was coheir of her father. Angmering, however, did not
descend to her heirs.
[HKF III:71, 182-183, 356; VCH Surrey III:4]
32 Ernald (I) LE RUS, of Stradbrook, Suff. Died Before 1159.
Ernald was granted Stradbrook, Suffolk, by Stephen count of Mortain
before the summer of 1125.
[HKF III:438]
48 Roger (I) de CLERE.
[HKF III:355]
56 Raoul de CHATELLERAULT, L of Faye. Died Before 1090.
[ES III/4:813]
He married Elisabeth de FAYE, Before 1144.
57 Elisabeth de FAYE.
[ES III/4:813]
62 Ranulf de BROC, of Angmering, Sussex. Died About 1179.
Ranulf was usher and marshal to king Henry II. He was given Angmering by
his uncle, known only as Guy. This gift was made with the consent of Nigel
de Broc and his brothers, and the gift was recorded in the Charter Roll in
7 John.
[HKF III:70-71, 356; VCH Surrey III:4]
He married Dametta.
63 Dametta.
[HKF III:70]
64 Roger LE RUS. Died Before 1125.
[HKF III:438]
112 Aimery I de CHATELLERAULT, Vc of Chatellerault. Died Before 1144 in
Noyers Abbey, France. Buried in Noyers Abbey, France.
[ES III/4:813]
He married Dangerose-Maubergeonne.
113 Dangerose-Maubergeonne.
[ES III/4:813]
114 Aimery de FAYE, L of Faye-la-Vineuse.
[ES III/4:813]
124 Oyn PURCEL.
[HKF III:70]
224 Boso II de CHATELLERAULT, Vc of Chatellerault. Died After 1090.
[ES III/4:810, 813]
He married Alienor de THOUARS, About 1075.
225 Alienor de THOUARS. Died After 1088.
[ES III/4:810, 813]
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------."
79850360. Robert Marmion
1Cokayne, Complete Peerage (Sutton Publishing, 2000 ed.), VIII:510.
79850361. Juliane de Vassy
1Cokayne, Complete Peerage (Sutton Publishing, 2000 ed.), VIII:510.
79850364. Nicholas fitz Ralph
1Medieval Genealogy Newsgroup.
I don't have the VCH Warks to hand but the following 6 generation ancester list includes the generations you seek and the reference(s) for each entry. 1 Amice MARMION.
"Subject: Re: Ancestry of Ellen de la Roche?
Date: 10/21/2000
Author: Richard Borthwick <[email protected]>
[VCH Warks 4:253]
She married John de WHITACRE. 2 Sir Robert MARMION. Died After 1316.
[VCH Warks 4:253; CP VIII:514] 3 Isabel. Died Before 1292.
CP says that Isabel was the daughter of Giles son of Ralph but VCH says her father (to whom she was heir) was Giles son of Nicholas.
[VCH Warks 4:253; CP VIII:514] 4 Philip MARMION, of Tamworth. Died Before 5 Dec 1291.
[CP VIII:510-512; VCH Warks 4:253]
He did not marry NN. 5 NN. 6 Giles FITZ NICHOLAS.
[VCH Warks 4:253] 7 Margery de APPLEBY.
[VCH Warks 4:253] 8 Robert (IV) MARMION, of Tamworth. Died About 1241/1243.
[CP VIII:510] 9 Juliane de VASSY.
[CP VIII:510] 12 Nicholas FITZ RALPH, of Nether Whitacre. Died Before 1262.
[VCH Warks 4:253] 14 Geoffrey de APPLEBY.
[VCH Warks 4:253] 16 Robert (III) MARMION, of Tamworth. Died Before 15 May 1218. [CP VIII:509-510]
17 Maud # de BEAUCHAMP.
Maud's affiliation to William (I) de Beauchamp is a speculation based on the discussion in the CP note.
[CP VIII:509 & note (j)] 18 Philip de VASSY.
[CP VIII:510] 24 Ralph FITZ RALPH, of Nether Whitacre. Died After 1235/1236. [VCH Warks 4:252] 32 Robert (II) MARMION, of Tamworth. Died About Oct 1181.
[CP VIII:508-509; ES III/4:625; R A Griffiths *Conquerors and Conquered in Medieval Wales* (Alan Sutton Publishing: Stroud, 1994) 199] 33 Elizabeth.
It was not Elizabeth but her mother-in-law, Milisent, who was daughter of Gervase count of Rethel. CP XIV:467 & 468 makes these corrections to CP VIII and ES.
[CP VIII:509, XIV:468; ES III/4:625] 34 William (I) de BEAUCHAMP, of Elmley & Salwarpe. Died 1170. [I J Sanders *English Baronies: A Study of their Origin and Descent* (Clarendon Press: Oxford, 1963 [1960]) 76] 48 Ralph FITZ WILLIAM, of Nether Whitacre, Warks.
[VCH Warks 4:252]."
79850366. Geoffrey de Appleby
1Medieval Genealogy Newsgroup.
I don't have the VCH Warks to hand but the following 6 generation ancester list includes the generations you seek and the reference(s) for each entry. 1 Amice MARMION.
"Subject: Re: Ancestry of Ellen de la Roche?
Date: 10/21/2000
Author: Richard Borthwick <[email protected]>
[VCH Warks 4:253]
She married John de WHITACRE. 2 Sir Robert MARMION. Died After 1316.
[VCH Warks 4:253; CP VIII:514] 3 Isabel. Died Before 1292.
CP says that Isabel was the daughter of Giles son of Ralph but VCH says her father (to whom she was heir) was Giles son of Nicholas.
[VCH Warks 4:253; CP VIII:514] 4 Philip MARMION, of Tamworth. Died Before 5 Dec 1291.
[CP VIII:510-512; VCH Warks 4:253]
He did not marry NN. 5 NN. 6 Giles FITZ NICHOLAS.
[VCH Warks 4:253] 7 Margery de APPLEBY.
[VCH Warks 4:253] 8 Robert (IV) MARMION, of Tamworth. Died About 1241/1243.
[CP VIII:510] 9 Juliane de VASSY.
[CP VIII:510] 12 Nicholas FITZ RALPH, of Nether Whitacre. Died Before 1262.
[VCH Warks 4:253] 14 Geoffrey de APPLEBY.
[VCH Warks 4:253] 16 Robert (III) MARMION, of Tamworth. Died Before 15 May 1218. [CP VIII:509-510]
17 Maud # de BEAUCHAMP.
Maud's affiliation to William (I) de Beauchamp is a speculation based on the discussion in the CP note.
[CP VIII:509 & note (j)] 18 Philip de VASSY.
[CP VIII:510] 24 Ralph FITZ RALPH, of Nether Whitacre. Died After 1235/1236. [VCH Warks 4:252] 32 Robert (II) MARMION, of Tamworth. Died About Oct 1181.
[CP VIII:508-509; ES III/4:625; R A Griffiths *Conquerors and Conquered in Medieval Wales* (Alan Sutton Publishing: Stroud, 1994) 199] 33 Elizabeth.
It was not Elizabeth but her mother-in-law, Milisent, who was daughter of Gervase count of Rethel. CP XIV:467 & 468 makes these corrections to CP VIII and ES.
[CP VIII:509, XIV:468; ES III/4:625] 34 William (I) de BEAUCHAMP, of Elmley & Salwarpe. Died 1170. [I J Sanders *English Baronies: A Study of their Origin and Descent* (Clarendon Press: Oxford, 1963 [1960]) 76] 48 Ralph FITZ WILLIAM, of Nether Whitacre, Warks.
[VCH Warks 4:252]."
79850434. William Pantulph
1Carl Boyer, 3rd, Medieval English Ancestors of Robert Abell (Carl Boyer, 3rd, P.O. Box 220333, Santa Clarita, CA 91322-0333), 191.
2Carl Boyer, 3rd, Medieval English Ancestors of Robert Abell, 191.
79850435. Hawise fitz Warin
1Carl Boyer, 3rd, Medieval English Ancestors of Robert Abell (Carl Boyer, 3rd, P.O. Box 220333, Santa Clarita, CA 91322-0333), 191.
2Carl Boyer, 3rd, Medieval English Ancestors of Robert Abell, 98.
79850448. Sir Bartolomew de Sudeley
1Carl Boyer, 3rd, Medieval English Ancestors of Robert Abell (Carl Boyer, 3rd, P.O. Box 220333, Santa Clarita, CA 91322-0333), 233.
79850449. Joan
1Carl Boyer, 3rd, Medieval English Ancestors of Robert Abell (Carl Boyer, 3rd, P.O. Box 220333, Santa Clarita, CA 91322-0333), 233.
2Carl Boyer, 3rd, Medieval English Ancestors of Robert Abell, 233.