Lorren Ancestry
(Lorren or MacLorren or McLorren or O'Lorren or
Laurin or MacLaurin or McLaurin or O'Laurin)
and his descendants

Updated 23 Feb. 2003

My link with this family is shown in bold "red".

The following information on the extensive family of our "COMMON" sire John Lorren is a constant work in progress.  As new information comes my way I will update this section to include adding and deleting information so I encourage you to check back every now and then for just such changes.  This information is to be used much like a "springboard" to perhaps put you in a direction of travel.  I owe a tremendous debt to:

Payne Daniel for his willingness to share the information available on his web page at (http://paynedaniel.com/) with me so that I could combine our information and bring you the most comprehensive Lorren information available to the "net" and to our extended family.

Mildred Perry for her willingness to share her vast knowledge of our Lorren and related families.  Mildred writes genealogy articles for the Cleburne News - People in Your Past

J.B. Lorren for his unselfish willingness to share information.  I met J.B. in the 80s, lost contact, and found him again this year.  I have talked with him on many occasions and regret that I have not been able to travel and give him a great big hug and thank you in person for all that he has done for our Lorren family research efforts.

Graylin Smith, another Knighton, Pollard, Lorren researcher, wrote me Feb 2003 and added information on his family.  Graylin's email address is [email protected]

I wish to make known two areas on this list that have enough unanswered questions to make the information as I present here questionable. The first is that there is a possibility that James B. Lorren (married to Jerri Ann Knighten) is the son of George A. Lorren and not John L.C. Lorren as I have listed below...if you choose to believe that James is the son of John L.C., then you must also assume that John L.C. Lorren had a first, unknown wife and pursue (along with me) documentation to back this assumption up.  You must also get a copy of the 1910 census (Alabama-Cleburne Co.) as this is the document that puts James B.'s parentage in question. The second question that you must consider involves whether George "Pap" Lorren is the son of Julia Pollard Knighten Lorren or Martha Price Lorren. The 1880 Census lists John and Julia's second son as "George, age 9". It is uncertain whether Julia and Martha both had sons named George.  I have moved George's place in the line as the last child of John and Julia ( instead of until I determine for sure how many George Pap's there were.  Researchers should also know that George "Pap" is listed on a page taken from the Lorren Bible but there is no birth date that would resolve who his mother was (at least that I have).  I ask that if you have documentation or obtain documentation resolving or confirming any information listed herein, please let me know.

I have not been able to take the "Lorren" surname back any further than I have listed below (John Lorren's marriage to Julia Ann McPherson). It is always possible that this is the "first" Lorren, but I don't believe this is so.  I think there is a strong possibility that the Lorren surname was once "O" Lorren or "Mac" Lorren...and it is also very likely that the original spelling was not "Lorren" - indeed, searching for the surname "Lorren" prior to George A. Lorren #1.1. below proved futile...so I started reviewing my documents again...other researchers had listed John and and Julia Ann (McPherson) as "Lorren" and their children with the "Lorren" spelling and spelled their daughter's name "Jerusha" and went on to state that Jerusha and her brothers were orphaned at a young age and that Jerusha went to live with her McPherson relatives; furthermore, the researchers stated this was shown in the 1850 Blount County, Alabama Census. This evening, March 1, 2002, I finally had the opportunity to review the Census and this is what I found (note the McPherson information is correct as research shows through documentation of the McPherson line):
HN FN Last Name First Name Age Sex Occup. Val. Birth-
495 498 McPherson Daniel 48 M Farmer 500 Ten.
495 498 McPherson Debyan 44 F -------- ------- S.C.
495 498 McPherson Wm. 23 M Farmer ------- Ala.
495 498 McPherson George 21 M Farmer -------- Ala.
495 498 McPherson Elizabeth 13 F -------- -------- Ala.
495 498 McPherson John D.  16 M Farmer -------- Ala.
495 498 McPherson Lucy 11 F -------- -------- Ala.
495 498 McPherson Richard 9 M -------- -------- Ala.
495 498 McPherson Nancy 7 F -------- -------- Ala.
495 498 McPherson Jas. 5 M -------- -------- Ala.
495 498 McPherson Monroe 3 M -------- -------- Ala.
495 498 LAURIN Jarncia 28 F -------- -------- Ala.
495 498 Sims Robert 28 M Farmer 150 S.C.
495 498 Sims Ann 18 F -------- -------- Ala.
495 498 Young Eliza 19 F -------- -------- Ala.

Looking at the above it is easy and reasonable to understand how "Laurin" could become "Lorren" and how "Jarncia" could become "Jerusha" - Both spellings of "Lorren" sound alike and "Jarncia" could have been read as "Jarucia" or "Jerusha" which would be a letter error.

Then I compared the McPherson information for the above McPherson family and this is what I found:

                                        George McPHERSON (note)
                                                 b. 1 Jan 1784 Hawkins Co., Tn
                                                 d. abt 1869 Blount Co., Al.
                                                 m. Nancy Ann KINCHELOE (dau of George KINCHELOE and
                                                      Sarah BUCKNER) 1799 in Washington Co., Tn
                                        Daniel R. McPHERSON
                                                                   b. 1801, Roane Co., Tn.,
                                                                   d. abt 1883, Blount Co., Al.
                                                                   m. Debbie Ann DAVENPORT
                                                    on 5 Dec 1824 Blount Co. Ala
                                                                   b. abt 1806
                                                          William Kincheloe McPherson
                                                                                         b. 1827-28
                                                                                         d. 1863
                                                                                         m. Susan J. McDONALD
                                                      Charles McPherson
                                                                                                                                               b. 21 Apr 1859
                                                                                                                                               d. 18 Aug 1870
                                                                                                           Elijah McPherson
                                                                                                                                               b. 9 Mar 1861
                                                                                                                                               m. Mary Bessie TARRANT
                                                                                                                                               2.1 Alva Lewis McPherson
                                                                                                                                                     b. 7 Jul 1907
                                                                                                                                                     m. Emma Lee JOHNSON
                                                                                                                                                           b. 3 Dec 1911
                                                                                                                                               2.2 Mary Tarrant McPherson
                                                                                                                                                      b. 12 Apr 1914
                                                       Debbie Ann McPherson
                                                                                         b. 1828 Blount Co., Al.
                                                                                         d. 15 April 1894
                                                                                         m. Alexander WHALEY
                                                                                             23 Sept. 1842 Blount Co., Al
                                                          George McPherson
                                                                                         b. 1829
                                                          John Davenport McPherson
                                                                                         b. 1833-34 Blount Co., Al
                                                                                         d. before 1867
                                                                                         m.  Sarah Ann STEPHENS
                                                                                               26 Sept. 1857
                                                                                         b. 1841/2 Ga
                                                                                              Her second marriage was
                                                                                              4 July 1867 Blount Co., Al.
                                                                                              to Docker B. Sapp
                                                          Elizabeth McPherson
                                                                                         b. 1836-37
                                                          Lucy T. McPherson
                                                                                         b. 8 Sept. 1839 Blount Co., Al
                                                                                         d. 3 May 1907 Jefferson Co., Al
                                                                                         m. James M. WOOTEN aka CANDLER
                                                                                              5 Oct. 1856 Blount Co., Al
                                                          Richard McPherson
                                                                                         b. 1840-41
                                                          Nancy McPherson
                                                                                         b. 1842-43
                                                                                         m. Wilson M. BROWN
                                                                                              6 Oct. 1860 Blount Co., Al
                                                          James Cullen McPherson
                                                                                         b. 1844-45
                                                                                         m. (1) Susan J. McDonald
                                                                                                   21 June 1869
                                                                                         m. (2) Mildred Evelyn White
                                                                                                   28 April 1885
                                                          Monroe Lafayette McPherson (twin)
                                                                                         b. 1847-48
                                                          Newton H. McPherson (twin)
                                                                                          b. 1847-48
                                                          Orpha I.H. McPherson
                                                                                          b. 1849-50
                                                                                          m. Thomas Sawyer
                                                                                 Thomas Sawyer, Jr.
                                                                                  Lewis Sawyer
                                                                                  Henry Sawyer

Then I looked at the 1860 Census for Calhoun Co., Ala where George "Lorren" (Jarncia/Jerusha's brother) is listed:

Alabama's Cleburne Co. 1860 Census Excerpt:

State of Alabama
Calhoun County
Sheet 439

Surname: Lorren Sex Age Born
George A.  Male 42 Missouri
Elizabeth Female 35 Georgia
Margaret Female 18 Georgia
William Male 16 Georgia
George Male 15 Georgia
Catherine Female 13 Georgia
John Male 12 Georgia
Sarah Female 9 Georgia
Martha Female 7 Alabama
Elizabeth Female 3 Alabama

Value of Real Estate $200
Value of Personal Estate  $575
Occupation Farmer

1870 CENSUS Excerpt
M593  Roll 12
Township 19  Range 11
July 18, 1870
Edwardsville Post Office
Cleburne County
Surname: Lorren Sex Age Occupation Born
George A.  Male 51 Farmer Missouri
Elizabeth Female 45 Housewife Georgia
Margaret Female 27 ----------------- -----------
George Male 24 ----------------- -----------
Catherine Female 21 ----------------- -----------
Sarah Female 19 -----------------  -----------
Martha Female 16 ----------------- -----------
James Male 9 ----------------- -----------
Thomas Male 5 ----------------- -----------
Missouri Female 2 ----------------- -----------
George      S. Male 1 ----------------- -----------

In the SOUNDEX, the name was spelled Lorron. On the Census, the name is spelled Lorren.  In the 1870 Census, (M593 Roll 9 Page 12 Township 19 Range 11) Edwardsville Post Office, Elizabeth is listed as Martha.  On the 1860 Federal Census for Calhoun Co., the wife of George A. Lorren is shown as Elizabeth.

Now I will search the "Laurin" surname and keep in mind that family stories state that the "Lorren" name once began with an "O"Lorren or "Mac"Lorren eventually dropping the "O"/"Mac".

Comments are welcome....

I will be adding "date information" and "notes" to the individuals in this data bank as time allows.  If you find a name that you need information on before I have it put up, please Email me!

1.  John LORREN/LAURIN (notes)
     b.  Betw. 1791-95 Hawkins Co., Tn
     d.  Betw.  1827-1834
     Note Some researchers believe this John is the first Lorren in the U.S. and is
               the British sailor that is mentioned throughout other researchers' works
               stating that there were two Johns - a Senior (above) and a Junior (the
               John son listed below)- I dispute this in that I believe and have researched
               on the assumption that the above Lorren is the Jr. I have requested
               records that I hope will verify what I believe to be the case - that there
               was indeed another "John Lorren" father to John above (making him
               the Jr.).  In thinking about this, I have used as my springboard family and
               other researchers' belief that John was a British sailor, his reasons for
               coming "South", family stories handed down, and a timeline of events
               in history relative to birth and death records.  I will update as soon as
               I have received the information that may clear this controversy up.
     m. Julia Ann MCPHERSON abt 1815 in Roane Co., Tn  (notes)
     b. Betw. 1794-1797 Hawkins Co., Tn
     d. 1829
     1.1 George A. LORREN/LAURIN (notes)
            b. abt. 1818 (Jefferson, Tn or Missouri as listed on Census)
            d. 25 Aug 1889
            Note:  It is also possible that George is the second son and his brother
                      John is the first born and the daughter, Jerusha, the baby.  I list
                      George as first as I have found no records on the son John's
            m. Elizabeth Martha D. ROBBERSON or ROBERTSON
         22 Apr 1841 Carrollton, Carroll Co., Ga
            Note: 1.  Carroll County Georgia Tax Digest 1842 - transcriber of this
                      document lists a "George A. LOVIN" 653 8 - I believe this may be
                      a transcription error for "Lorren"; also, Elijah McPherson Agt 813 7
                      listed on this tax roll - Elijah McPherson was a brother of George's
                      2.  GEORGIA CIVIL WAR SOLDIER INDEX - Page 174 -
                           states a G.A. "Loren" Private served in Company H, 1st Reg't, GA
                           and then gives a G.A. "Lorren" Private served in Company H,
                           1st Reg't, GA Cav. - This is probably the same G.A.
            b.  1825 Ga
            d.  Aft. 1880
            1.1.1 Margaret LORREN
                b. 11 Nov. 1843 Cleburne Co., AL
                     d. betw. 1880-1932
                         buried: Oak Level, AL
                     m. Allen SMITH aft 1852 at Camp Creek
            George SMITH
                                 b. 20 Oct. 1869
                                 m. Almary PALMER betw. 1886/1919
            Samuel SMITH
                                 b. 12 Nov 1876
                                 m. Emma PALMER betw. 1893/1926
            Ella Madora SMITH
                                 b. 6 Aug 1878
                                 m. William BAILEY betw 1892/1925
            1.1.2 William Jefferson LORREN
                     b. 10 Apr 1844 Ga
                          buried Oak Level Methodist Church Cemetery, Cleburn Co., Ala.
                     d. 22 Nov 1914
                     m. Nancy (Narcissa) Jane WEST abt 1858
                          b. 1 Nov 1838 Ga
                          d. 28 Oct.1926 Borden Springs, Al
                              buried beside her husband
                                      (L.R. Lorren lists the wife as Jane Platt - dau of Lampkin Platt; their
                               gravestones read: W.J. Lorren, Born Apr. 10, 1840,
                               Died Nov. 22, 1914; Nancy Plott Lorren, Born Nov. 1, 1838,
                               Died Oct. 28, 1926)
                     Notes:  Appears 1880 and 1910 Cenus Cleburne Co., Alabama
            William B. LORREN
                                 b. abt. 1867 Oak Level, Cleburne Co., Al
                                 m. Emma REED (REID)
                                      m. bef. 1910
                                      b. 1892
                                 Notes: appears on 1920 Alabama Census; Emma was the dau of
                                            Joseph B. Reid and Helena Carrie HART)
                          Alma D. LORREN
                                                  b. after 1900 - date withheld
                          Leon "Jutson" LORREN
                                                 b. 1912 Oak Level, Cleburne Co., Al
                                                       buried Bogolusa, Washington Co., Al
                                                       m. Josephine Jean SAVOIE
                                                       b. aft 1900 - date withheld)
                                          Loy Raymond "Pug" LORREN
                                                        b. aft 1900 - date and place withheld
                                                                     m. Margaret J. RAGLAND
                                                                     b. aft 1900 - date and place withheld
                                                                     Notes: Margaret was the dau of William B.
                                                                                 Ragland and Cora Lee COOPER
                                                            Shelley R. LORREN
                                                                             b. aft 1900 - date withheld
                                          Lonnie D. LORREN
                                          Schandra Jean LORREN
                          Rachal LORREN
                                                  b. aft 1900 - date withheld
                          Cleo LORREN
                                                  b. aft 1900 - date withheld
                          Willie LORREN
                                                  b. aft 1900 - date withheld
            Elizabeth "Martha" LORREN
                    b. 1869 Oak Level, Cleburne Co., Al
            Sarah LORREN
                             b. 1872 Oak Level, Cleburne Co., Al
                                 m. I.E. MILLER 28 Feb 1889 Calhoun Co., Al
            John Thomas LORREN
                             b.  28 Dec 1873 Oak Level, Cleburne Co., Al
                                 d. 6 Feb 1959
                                     buried Oak Level Cemetery, Cleburne Co., Al
                                 m. Carrie L. ? on  28 Oct 1893
                                 b. 7 Mar 1877
                                     Note:  she is buried beside her husband; no date on headstone
                        Lela LORREN
                                           b. 4 Aug 1897
                                                m. Charles POTTS
                        Mervin M. LORREN
                                                b. 29 Mar 1900
                                                d. betw. 1921/1990
                                                m. Maude BEACHAM
                                                 Children (birth order unknown):
                                        Paul LORREN
                                                                   m. Ruby BYERS  (photo)
                                                                   Notes: Ruby dau of Pat Byers and Bessie ?
                                                      Kathy LORREN  (photo)
                                                                                        m.  Richard POLLARD (photo)
                                                          William Bill LORREN
                                                                                        m. Sarah Glenda IVY
                                                                               William S. LORREN
                                                                               William C. LORREN
                                      Henry LORREN
                                          Pete LORREN
                                          Melvin LORREN
                                          Jaunita LORREN
                        Willie Mae LORREN
                                                b. aft 1900 - date withheld
                                                m. Paul JONES
                        Ruth LORREN
                                                b. aft 1900 - date withheld
                                                m. Ervin MORSE
                        Gladys LORREN
                                                b. aft 1900 - date withheld
                                                m. L.K. TYLER
                        Flora LORREN
                                                m. Edward GALLAGHER
            Emma LORREN
                            b. 1875 Oak Level, Cleburne Co., Al
            O. Webster LORREN (listed in 1870 Cenus-Alabama)
            Etta Bell LORREN
            1.1.3 George Lauderdale LORREN
                b. 4 Jul 1845 Esom Hill, Polk Co.,  Ga
                     d. 10 Jul 1916 Esom Hill, Polk Co., Ga
                          buried: Cherry Grove Cemetery, Palestine, Ala
                     m (1) Nancy Mariny WRIGHT bef. 1879
                      b. 1856
                      d. 1897 Cleburne Co., Al
                     m. (2) Martha Aveline FORRISTER on 3 Jan 1899, Polk Co., Ga
                    b.  Dec. 1870 Cherokee Co., NC
                      d.  15 Dec 1942 Haralson, Ga.
                     Notes:  1. George and Nancy lived next door to John and Julia (Pollard) Lorren
                                 at the time of the 1880 Polk Co., Ala Census; Census takers added an
                                 "s" to Lorren surname; George lived next to Thomas Lorren when the
                                 1900 Polk Co., Ala Census was taken; 2. Martha Aveline Forrister was
                                 married to an unknown "Jones" prior to her marriage to George.
            Ella E. LORREN
                                 b. 1 Jan 1879
                                 d. aft. 1951 Calhoun Co., Al
                                 m. Elijah WHEELER
            William Jefferson "Bud" LORREN
                                 b. 19 Apr 1882 Oak Level, Cleburne Co., Ala
                                 d. 7 Mar 1952 Arteriosclerotic heart disease (note 1)
                                     buried: Shiloah Baptist Church Cemetery
                                 m. (1) Betty (Bettie) FORRESTER on 13 Dec 1901 Polk Co., Ga
                                           b. 8 Jul 1884 Cleburne Co., Al
                                           d. 8 Dec 1965
                                Notes: Betty (Bettie) was the dau of John Coleman Forrester and Martha
                                             "Louisa" HART of Esom Hill, Ga; William appears on 1910 Polk
                                             County, Ga. Census
                        Lou "Lula" LORREN
                                               b. 7 Mar 1903
                        James Milton "Milt" LORREN
                                                b. 30 May 1905
                                                m. Willie COX (dau of Mark Robert COX) 9 Oct 1927
                                                b. 16 Oct 1905 Fanning Co., Ga
                                          Note:  In the Polk County Georgia Death Records for
                                                          1951-1965, Georgia Court of Ordinary, Index to
                                                          Death Certificates, Book B, a Mrs. James Milton
                                                          Lorren(s) is listed as dying on 7 Nov 1958 of
                                                          multiple skull fractures.  I don't know if this is
                                       James LORREN
                                       Roy LORREN
                                       John LORREN
                                       Mrs. Clifton Lorren WESTER
                        Ethel Mae "Totsy" LORREN
                                                b. 18 May 1908 Esom Hill, Ga
                                                d. 2 Jun 1982 Monahans, Tx
                                                m. (1) Carl COX 3 Jul 1925
                                                           b. 1907
                                                           d. 1973 Corsicanna, Tx
                                               m. (2) Lyle SANDERS
                                      Don COX
                                      Larry COX
                                      Richard COX
                                      Linda COX
                                                                 m. ? BRIDGES
                                      Terry COX (female)
                                                                 m. ? GRANT
                                      Jamie COX (female)
                                                                 m. ? GIBBS
                   Ruth Gertrude LORREN
                                           b. aft 1900 - date withheld
                        Marvin LORREN
                                           b. 12 Sept 1913
                                                d. 3 Dec 1989
                                                m. Audie Halsey SMITH
                        Nettie Bell LORREN
                                                b. 29 Jul 1917
                                                d. 13 Nov 1987
                                                m. Clifford Paul COX
                                       Evelyn COX
                                                                  m. ? BROWN
                        Nellie Lucile LORREN
                                                b. aft 1900 date withheld
                                                m. ? MORGAN
                        Ruby LORREN
                                                b. aft 1900 date withheld
                                                m. ? PACKER 21 Mar 1942
                        Josephine "JO" LORREN
                                                b. aft 1900 date withheld
                                                m. Joe TRIOUFO (TRIONFO)
                                  m. (2) Frances "Fannie" PRIETER
            Ollie Etta LORREN
                             b. 5 Nov 1880
            Martha Della LORREN
                             b. 26 Oct 1883 Roane Co., Tn
                             Note: 1910 Census states she was born NC and researches should be
                                            aware that Roane Co,Tn was once considered NC territory
             Effie LORREN
                             b. Mar 1885 Cherokee Co., NC
             Minnie Bell LORREN
                                  b. Jun 1890 in Cherokee Co., NC or Polk Co., Ga
             Robert Lee LORREN
                                  b. 19 Apr 1895 Ga
             Videl LORREN
                                  b. abt 1908
                             Notes: listed as a 2 year old on 1910 Polk Co., Ga Census
             Georgia Louisa LORREN
                                  b. 22 Oct 1900 Ga
            1.1.4  Katherine (Catherine) LORREN
                      b. abt 1849 Cleburne Co., Al
                      d. 1941
                 Notes: 1870 Census states her age as 21
            1.1.5  John L.C. LORREN (photo)
                       b. 1847 (family Bible) (note: LDS records state he was born 1840)
                       d. 1931
                 Note:  If you are connected in this line and find information that you
                                 know is wrong, please, please contact me.  It is at this point my
                                 research is word of mouth.  Names of children may be
                                 repeated, births out of order,  and whether John was married
                                 twice or three times is not known for sure.  I can only be sure
                                 of my line through Samuel Prathell Lorren, John's son by
                                 Julia (Pollard)(Knighten) Lorren.  So if you are a sibling and
                                 can add to or correct me, please write so that, eventually, we
                                 may have an accurate lineage.
                       m. (1) ?
              James Breckenridge (J.B.) LORREN (photo) (story)
                                   b. 1 Dec 1860
                                   d. 12 Oct 1922
                             Note:  Named for General Breckenridge, Civil War.
                                   m. Jerri Ann (Annie) Elevelton KNIGHTEN 20 May 1875 (photo)
                                        (dau of Julia POLLARD and Jeremiah KNIGHTEN
                                        b. 23 Sept 1863
                                        d. 26 Sept 1944
                          Mary (Mollie) LORREN
                                                  b. 1 Aug 1881
                                                  d. 15 May 1922
                                                  m. ? PORTER
                                          Luldar PORTER
                                          Manson Anderson PORTER
                                          Eunice PORTER
                                                                     m. ? CHATMAN
                                          Odie PORTER
                                                                     m. ? CHATMAN
                                          Mary Ann PORTER
                                          Ervin PORTER
                                          Daniel PORTER
                                          Lincoln PORTER
                                          Dellie PORTER
                                          Lois PORTER
                                                                       m. ? BROWN
                          James (Bill) Wright LORREN
                                                   b. 29 Sept 1885
                                                   d. 1950s
                                                   m. Unknown
                                          Elithbeth (sic) LORREN
                                          Andy LORREN
                                          Susie LORREN
                                          Nelson LORREN
                                          Ruby LORREN
                                          Fannie LORREN
                                          Flora LORREN
                                          James LORREN
                                          Paul LORREN
                          Sarah Ellen LORREN
                                                  b. 18 Jun 1888
                                                  m. ? HOPKINS
                                         Charles HOPKINS
                                         Henry HOPKINS
                                         Corelee HOPKINS
                                         Arthur HOPKINS
                                         Alvin HOPKINS
                                         Hoyte HOPKINS
                                         Jewel HOPKINS
                          John Marion Luther LORREN
                                             b.  Apr 1890
                                                  d.  June 1965
                                                  m. Nancy Lou Venie BARNES (1st Cousin)
                                                       dau of Missouri Lorren & James Barns
                                         James Luther LORREN
                                                                    m. Almer AARON
                                                           Annie Ruth LORREN
                                                                                   m. ? WHITAKER
                                                           E.J. LORREN
                                                           Alvin LORREN
                                         Gordon LORREN
                                                                    m. Lavate NEELY
                                                            John R. LORREN
                                                            Carrol LORREN (male)
                                                                                          m. ?
                                                                                          2.2.1 Michelle LORREN
                                                                                                   m. ? CLIFTON
                                         John Alvin "Dick" LORREN
                                                                    m. Georgia BAILEY
                                                           Linda J. LORREN
                                                                                   m. ? ANTHONY
                                                           Johnnie LORREN (female)
                                                                                   m. ? MOREN
                                                           Earnest LORREN
                                                           Carolyn LORREN
                                                                                   m. ? WHITE
                                         Leroy "Roy" LORREN
                                                                    m. Lucille SMITH
                                         Clarence LORREN
                                                                    m. Doris JOHNSON
                                                           Clarence Wade LORREN
                                                           Sandra A. LORREN
                                                                                         m. ? HICKS
                                                           Mary Jeannette LORREN
                                                                                         m. ? YOUNG
                                                           Nancy Sue LORREN
                                                                                         m. ? PENDERGRASS
                                                          Sheba Rose LORREN
                                                                                         m. ? GARRETT
                                                           Pamela  Jo LORREN
                                                                                         m. ? HEELEY
                                                           Jonathan LORREN
                                                           Debra Kaye LORREN
                                                                                         m. ? VASSAR
                                                           Jeffrey Lynn LORREN
                                                           Christopher Robin LORREN
                                         Lillian LORREN
                                                                    m. Russell Haggard DOWNING
                                                           Russell Gene DOWNING
                                                           Benny Ray DOWNING
                                                           Johnny Edward DOWNING
                                         James "JB" LORREN
                                                                    m. Mary Elizabeth DIXON
                                                           Clara Lee LORREN
                                                                                         m. ? MURRAY
                                                           Martha Annette LORREN
                                                                                         m. #1 ? RAZER
                                                                                         m. #2 ? MCFARLIN
                                                           Larry James LORREN
                                          Edna Jewell LORREN
                                                                     m. Stanley T. GREGG
                                                            Danny Ray GREGG
                                                            Patricia Ann GREGG
                                                            Kenneth Stewart GREGG
                                         Ova Dee LORREN
                                                                    m. Henry KIRKWOOD
                                                           Henry "Hank" KIRKWOOD
                                                           Francis KIRKWOOD
                                                           Wendy KIRKWOOD
                                         Harold "Jimmy" LORREN
                           George LORREN
                                                   b. 24 Feb 1884
                                                   d. 24 Apr 1884
                           Julia Lee (Rosie/Rosa) LORREN
                                              b. 29 Nov 1896
                                                   d. 8 Jun 1966
                                                   m. (1) William Cleveland "Cleve" PUCKETT
                                              m. (2) MULLINS
                                          Bessie PUCKETT
                                                                     m. ? FORRISTER
                                          Emily PUCKETT
                                          Monroe PUCKETT
                                          Andrew MULLINS
                                          Flora Mae MULLINS
                           Lula LORREN (note 2)
                                              b. 29 Nov 1896
                                                   d. 8 Jun 1966
                                                   m (1) Monroe THOMASON
                                              m (2) ? HINDMON
                                          Gladys THOMASON
                                                                     m. ? GREEN
                                          Joseph Robert THOMASON
                      Lillie Mae LORREN (note 3)
                                               b. 21 Mar 1899
                                                     m. James Avery Alfred WADDELL
                                           James E.J. WADDELL
                                           Avery R.C. WADDELL
                            Venie Estella LORREN
                                                    b. 2 Aug 1901
                                                    d. Sept 1970
                                                    m. William Washington FORRISTER
                                                     b. 1896
                                                     d. 1956
                                                     Note: William's grandchild Graylin Smith
                                                     [email protected] states that "William
                                                     was the son of William Brownlow FORRISTER
                                                     and Langly PORTER" and adds that "both the
                                                     Forrister's and Porters came to North Alabama/
                                                     Georgia just after the War Between the States.
                                                     They came from Murphy (Cherokee County)
                                                      North Carolina.  Many of them were just over
                                                      the Georgia line from Cleburne county Alabama.
                                                      William Brownlow was born about 1870 in
                                                      Georgia (not positive but I believe Esom Hill).
                                                      His parents were Johnny Coleman Forrister
                                                      and Louise WELCH."
                                           William FORRISTER
                                           Carl FORRISTER
                                           Jack FORRISTER
                                           Mildred FORRISTER
                                           Brownloe FORRISTER
                                           Roscoe FORRISTER
                                           Gertrude (aka Gurtridge) FORRISTER
                                                                      b. 15 Feb 1933
                                                                      p. Borden Springs, Cleburn Co., Ala
                                                                      m.  ? SMITH
                                                              Graylin SMITH
                                           Estell FORRISTER
                                                                      m. ? SALMON
                                           Annie Ruth FORRISTER
                                           Jessie FORRISTER
                                           Russel FORRISTER
                                           Joe FORRISTER
                                           Jimmy FORRISTER
                           Louella LORREN
                                                b. 2 Aug 1901
                                                     m. Bill CAIN
                                            Harvey CAIN
                                            Fred CAIN
                                            Annie Lou CAIN
                                                                        m. ? HUDGINS
                                            Alvin CAIN
                                            Elmer CAIN
                                            Clifford CAIN
                           Thomas (Tom) LORREN (murdered out west)
                                                 b. 9 Jan 1904
                                                      d. 1950s
                           Alex B. (or P.) LORREN
                                                b. 21 Jun 1907
                                                     d. 16 Feb 1932
                                                     m. Bessie (Ann) SEIGLER
                                                b. withheld aft. 1900
                                            Annie Mae LORREN
                                                                   b. withheld aft. 1900
                                            James Clifford LORREN
                                                                   b. withheld aft 1900
                       m. (2) Julia Ann POLLARD (KNIGHTEN) (photo)
                                 b. 20 Mar 1838
                                 d. 6 Aug. 1899 Borden Springs, Alabama
                                     Buried:  Borden Springs Cemetery, Cleburne Co., AL gravestone
                                     reads "LArren)
                                     Children by Jeremiah KNIGHTEN:(see Knighten)
                                     1. Acker KNIGHTEN
                                         m. ? __________
                                         1.1 Charlie C. KNIGHTEN
                                         1.2 John E. KNIGHTEN
                                         1.3 Ben KNIGHTEN
                                         1.4 W.C. KNIGHTEN
                                               m. ? _________
                                               1.4.1 Sudie Mae KNIGHTEN
                                         1.5 J.C. KNIGHTEN
                                         1.6 Bertie KNIGHTEN
                                         1.7 Julia KNIGHTEN
                                     2. Sarah KNIGHTEN
                                         m. ? WOODARD
                                          2.1 George WOODARD
                                          2.2 John WOODARD
                                          2.3 Edmond WOODARD
                                     3.  Thomas Wright KNIGHTEN
                                         m. ____________
                                          3.1 Charlie KNIGHTEN
                                                m. Luther WHEELER
                                          3.2 Crady (Grady) KNIGHTEN
                                          3.3 Lizzie KNIGHTEN
                                                m. William AHERN
                                          3.4 Hettie Mae KNIGHTEN
                                                m. Clarence ALLISON
                                          3.5 Addie KNIGHTEN
                                                m. Mac MCDONALD
                                          3.6 Gussie KNIGHTEN
                                                m. Ellis KELLY
                                                3.6.1 Inez KELLY
                                                3.6.2 Myrtle KELLY
                                    4.  William Alex KNIGHTEN
                                    5.  Annie KNIGHTEN (Jerri Ann) (photo)
                                         m. (1) J.B. LORREN (half brother) # (listed above) (photo)
                                         m. (2) George C. SMITH
         Children (by John L.C. LORREN)
              William Aaron LORREN (photo at Payne Daniel's site) (note 4)
                             b. 1 Sept 1870 Ga?
                                   d. 22 Apr 1947 Cleburne Co., Ala
                                   buried: Borden Springs Church of Christ Cemetery
                                               Cleburne County, AL
                                   m.  Lutisha Cathren ABNEY(photo at Payne Daniel's site)
                             b. 29 Dec 1875 Cleburne Co, Ala
                                   d. 28 Apr 1956 Cherokee Co., Ala
                                   buried: : Borden Springs Church of Christ Cemetery
                                               Cleburne County, AL
                          Virgil LORREN
                          Emil Newton LORREN
                                     b. 2 Nov 1894 in Cleburne Co. Ala
                                                  d. 15 Aug 1985 in Raleigh, NC, Wake County
                                                       buried Raleigh Memorial Park, NC
                                                  m. Ruby Florence WARMACK (ancestry at Payne's site)
                                                      on 5 Jan 1930 "over the line" Calhoun Co. Ala. or Ga
                                                  b.  25 Nov 1905 Cleburne Co., Ala
                                                 d.  22 Oct 1996 Raleigh, NC, Wake County
                                                       buried: Raleigh Memorial Park, NC
                                         Charlotte Ethelyn LORREN
                                                               b. aft 1900 - date and place withheld
                                                                    m. Joseph Clyde CHERRY
                                                               b. 12 Sept 1932 Memphis, Tn
                                                                    d. 12 May 1989 Atlanta, Ga
                                                                    Notes: Joseph was the son of Sydney Clyde Cherry
                                                                               and Wynogene WYMAN
                                                           Richard Wayne CHERRY
                                                                                    b. aft 1900 - date withheld
                                                                                         m. Caroline HOWIE
                                                                                    b. aft 1900 - date withheld
                                                                                Heather CHERRY
                                                                                Elizabeth CHERRY
                                                           Linda Jean CHERRY
                                                                                    b. aft 1900 - date withheld
                                                                                         m. (1) John Joel BYERLY (BYERLEY)
                                                                                         m. (2)  Anthony Wayne TRUJILLO
                                                                                         Notes:  John Byerly is the son
                                                                                                      of Thomas Evans Byerley
                                                                                                      and Ruth Lenora TATE
                                                                                Lauren TRUJILLO
                                                           Brenda Jo CHERRY
                                                                                         m. Rusty WHITE
                                                                                Lindsay Jo WHITE
                                                                                Charlotte A. WHITE
                                         Clarice Rayonelle LORREN
                                                                    b. aft 1900 - date and place withheld
                                                                    m. Alton Glenn HOLLAND
                                                               b. aft 1900 - date and place withheld
                                                                    Notes:  Alton is the son of Thomas Avris Holland, Sr.
                                                                                and Julia Ruth JOHNSON
                                                           Alton Glenn HOLLAND, Jr.
                                                                                         m. Kay Frances POORE
                                                                                         Notes: Kay is the dau of Franklin
                                                                                                     Edward Poore and Maxine
                                                                                David G. HOLLAND
                                                                                Johnathan HOLLAND
                                                           Daniel Aaron HOLLAND
                                                                                         m. Jennifer Elizabeth DILLARD
                                                                                Elizabeth R. HOLLAND
                                                                                Michael A. HOLLAND
                                                                                Thomas L. HOLLAND
                                                           Andrew Ray HOLLAND
                                                                                         m. Melissa Lynn FERGUSON
                                                                                Amanda HOLLAND
                                                                                Rebekah  HOLLAND
                           Shirley Catherine LORREN
                                                                   b. aft 1900 - date and place withheld
                                                                   m. Garland Payne DANIEL
                                                                   b. aft 1900 - date and place withheld
                                                                   Notes: Garland is the son of James William Cromwell
                                                                              Daniel and Bonnie Gertrude MILLER
                                                          Stephen Marshall DANIEL
                                                                                        m. (1) Cindy Jean ARTHUR
                                                                               Catherine E.DANIEL
                                                                               Laura J. DANIEL
                                                                                        m. (2) Patricia Sue HITES (GALLOWAY)
                                                                                        1. Nicholas GALLOWAY
                                                                                                                           m. Jerrica MARTINEZ
                                                                                                                       1 Justin GALLOWAY
                                                           Stephanie Lorren DANIEL
                                                                                         m. Jame Alex CLAYTON
                                                                                Rachel M. CLAYTON
                                                                                Adam D. CLAYTON
                                                                                Sabrina N. CLAYTON
                                         Ruby Mitchell "Mitchie" LORREN
                                                               b. aft 1900- date and place withheld
                                                                    m. (1) Stacy Lynwood JONES
                                                                    b. aft 1900 - date withheld
                                                                    d. 11 May 1983
                                                                    m. (2) James Scott SHAW
                                                                    b. 18 Aug 1938
                                                                    d. 13 Sept 1996 Raleigh, NC
                                                                    Notes: Stacy was the son of Henry D. Jones
                                                                                and Alma Bass WILLIAMS; James Shaw
                                                                                was the son of George Scott Shaw and
                                                                                Hazel D. HANNA
                                                           Rhonda Lynn JONES
                                                                                         m. Benjamin Lewis BARNES
                                                                                Benjamin BARNES II
                                                                                                                                                       m. Courtney HARLOW
                                                                                Christopher BARNES
                                                           Kathryn (Kathy) Elizabeth JONES
                                                                                        m. David Timothy WEAVER
                                                                                James L. WEAVER
                                                                                Allison R. WEAVER
                                                           David Wayne JONES
                                                                                         m. Deborah Joy CREECH
                                                                                Christina M. JONES
                                                                                                                 m. Leslie MCIVER
                                                                                Samantha L. JONES
                                                                                Avery N. JONES
                                                           Tracee JONES
                                                                                          m. (1) ? BOLICK
                                                                                 Stacy BOLICK
                                                                                           m. (2) ? WARREN
                                                                                  Travis WARREN
                                                                                  Christopher WARREN
                                                                                           m. (3) ? SMILEY
                          John L. LORREN
                                                  b. 1896 Borden Springs, Cleburne Co., Ala
                                                  d. 4 Jul 1939 Raleigh, Wake Co., NC
                                                  buried New Bethel Cemetery Borden Springs, Ala
                                                  m.  Anna GILLEY
                                                  b. 3 Jun 1892 Ala
                                                  d. 15 Apr 1970 Raleigh, Wake Co., NC
                                                  buried Raleigh Memorial Park Cemetery near her children
                                                  Notes: Anna was the dau of John Gilley and Francis TURNER
                                         John Harlson LORREN
                                                                    b. 20 Jul 1915
                                                                    d. 17 Jul 1993 Raleigh, NC
                                         Kathleen LORREN
                                                                    b. 17 Jul 1924
                                                                    d. 14 Oct 2000 Raleigh, NC
                                                                    m. William THOMAS
                                                           Dell THOMAS
                                                           Natasha THOMAS
                                                                            m. ? LONGNECKER
                                                           Sherin THOMAS
                                                                            m. ? SMETANA
                                         Claude Elton LORREN
                                                                    b. 14 Feb 1927
                                                                    d. 17 Jun 1986 Raleigh, NC
                                                                    m. Angeline FERRANT
                                                           Stanly LORREN
                                                           Claudia LORREN
                                                                                         m. ? POLLANDER
                                                           Chrisie LORREN
                                                                                         m. ? ANDERSON
                                                           Marie LORREN
                                                           John Claude LORREN
                                                                                         b. 1946
                                                                                         d. 8 Feb 2000
                                                                                         m.  Victoria ?
                                                                                Karin LORREN
                                                                                                                 m. Frank WINSLOW III
                                                                                Karyl LORREN
                                                                                                                 m. Kent CASHWELL
                                                                                 Kristen LORREN
                                                                                                                  m. Greg PERCY
                                                                                 Janice LORREN
                                                                                                                  m. Felt HAIRR
                                         Ruby Mae LORREN
                                                       b. 13 May 1929
                                                                    d. 16 Apr 1968 Raleigh, Wake Co., NC
                                                                    m. Douglas FORD
                           Ora A. LORREN
                                                b. 27 Oct 1899 Cleburne Co., Ala
                                                   d. 5 Feb 1921 Cleburne Co., Ala
                                                   buried New Bethel Cemetery, Borden Springs, Ala
                                                   m. Levi SADLER (SADDLER)
                                                   b.  9 Oct 1886
                                                   d.  4 Nov 1947
                                                   buried:  Borden Springs Church of Christ Cemetery
                                                                Cleburne County, AL
                                          Katy SADLER (SADDLER)
                                                                     m. Edward (E.G.) MACON, Jr.
                                                                     b. abt 1919
                                                                     d. ? Jan 2001
                                                                     buried Montlawn Memorial Park, Raleigh, NC
                                                            Paul MACON
                                          James William SADLER (SADDLER)
                                                        b. 1921
                                                                     d. 1996 Cleburne Co., Ala
                                                                     m. Inez HULSEY
                                                        Notes: In 1982 operated store at Palestine, Ala
                                                            Geraldine SADLER (SADDLER)
                                                            Brenda SADLER (SADDLER)
                           William Isaac LORREN
                                      b. 14 Aug 1900 Borden Springs, Ala
                                                  d. 15 May 1935 Anniston, Ala
                                                        buried New Bethel Cemetery Borden Springs, Ala
                                                   m. Lillian HARALSON
                                                   b. 14 Feb 1898 DeKalb Co., Ala
                                                   d. 15 May 1982
                                          William Earl LORREN
                                                        b. 1923
                                                                     d. 1924
                                          Janie Katherene LORREN
                                                                     b. aft 1900 - date withheld
                                                                     m. (1) Hershel BROOKS
                                                         b. 3 Jul 1920
                                                                     d. 1 Sept 1963
                                                                     m. (2) John Harvey HARRIS
                                                            Jerry BROOKS
                                                            Garland BROOKS
                                          Harlan LORREN
                                                        b. 1928
                                                                     d. 1940
                           Theresa "Thersie" LORREN
                                               b. 19 Jul 1904 Cleburne Co., Ala
                                                    d. 22 Nov 1980 Raleigh, NC
                                                    m. Robert C. DYER
                                               b. 26 May 1911
                                                    d. Oct 1989 Raleigh, NC
                                           Billie Dove DYER
                                           Jessie Lee DYER
                                                                      m. John Wesley WILLIAMS
                                                             Joni Lyn WILLIAMS
                                                                                           b. abt 1965
                                                                                           d. 17 Jun 1996 Raleigh NC
                                                                                                blood clot in lung
                                                             Jill Theresa WILLIAMS
                                           Emil DYER
                           Agee V. LORREN
                                              b. 1906 Cleburne Co., Ala
                                                   d. 1964 Gadsden, Etowah Co., Ala
                                                        buried Crestwood Cemetery, Gadsden, Ala
                                                   m. Alma "Willis" MULLINS
                                              b. 1907
                                                   d. 1986 Gadsden, Ala
                                          Willis Eugene LORREN
                                                                      m. Brenda Marjory SMITH in England
                                                                      b. aft 1900 date withheld
                                                                           Cheltenham, England
                                                             Steven LORREN
                                                                                           m. Julia BROTHERS
                                                                                  Jeremy S. LORREN
                                                                                  Daniel C. LORREN
                                                             Sharon LORREN
                                                                                           m. Darrel Bruce SMITH
                                                                                  April N. SMITH
                                                                                                                    m. ? HARTLEY
                                                                                  Robert Bruce SMITH
                                                                                  Darrell Lorren SMITH
                           Pearl Lenor LORREN
                                              b. 16 Apr 1908 Cleburne Co., Ala
                                                   d. 25 Jan 1968 Spring Garden, Cherokee Co., Ala
                                                      buried Piedmont Memory Gardens, Piedmont, Ala
                                                   m. Floyd William BASWELL
                                              b. 6 Jan 1908
                                                   d. 15 Jan 1981
                                                       buried alongside wife
                                          Lona Ree BASWELL
                                                                     b. 9 May 1931
                                                                     d. 12 Nov 1989
                                                                          buried New Bethel Cemetery, Borden Springs,
                                                                     m. Jefferson Earnest HUNT
                                                        b. 9 May 1931
                                                                     d. 12 Nov 1989
                                                                         buried alongside wife
                                                            Gail HUNT (female)
                                                                                          m. ? LEE
                                                            Doris HUNT
                                                                                         m. ? LINER
                                                            Sue HUNT
                                                            Thomas HUNT
                                                            William Daniel HUNT
                                                            Nancy HUNT
                                                                                          m. ? OWENS
                                          Casa Nova (Casey) BASWELL
                                                        b. 7 May 1932
                                                                     d. 5 Oct 2000 Ala
                                                                     m. Annie Dell DEMPSEY
                                                            Billy Nova BASWELL
                                                            Judy BASWELL
                                                                                          m. ? MCGATHA
                                                            Patricia BASWELL
                                                                                          m. ? SURRETT
                                                            Samuel BASWELL
                                                            Michael BASWELL
                                                            Bobby Wayne BASWELL
                                                            Sherry Lynne BASWELL
                                                                                          m. ? SAUCEDA
                                          Toni Carolyn BASWELL
                                                                     m. Druey H. TIERCE
                                                            Dennis Ray TIERCE
                                                                                          m. Mary CRANE
                                                            Carol Mereia TIERCE
                                                                                          m. Ronnie PAYNE
                                                                                 Brandi N. PAYNE
                                          Herbert W. BASWELL
                                                                     m. Linda MOTES
                                                            Sandra BASWELL
                                                                                          m. ? COKER
                                                            Shirley BASWELL
                                                                                          m. ? BLACK
                                                                                 Ethan BLACK
                                                                                 Jacob Rhyse BLACK
                                                            Carley BASWELL (male)
                                          Pearl Raynell BASWELL
                                                                    m. (1) Sam C. BARRETT
                                                                    b. 4 Mar 1935
                                                                    d. 23 Dec 1958
                                                                    buried Piedmont Memory Gardens, Piedmont,
                                                                    m. (2) ? BRADSHAW
                                                           Ray Scott BRADSHAW
                                                                                         m. Teresa EDWARDS
                                                                                Austin H. BRADSHAW
                                                                                Bruce H. BRADSHAW
                                                           Bruce H. BRADSHAW
                                          Betty Lou BASWELL
                                                                     m. Wendell Eugene JACKSON
                                                           Wendell Gregory JACKSON
                                                                                          m. Terry REAVES
                                                                                 Shawna L. ELLIS
                                                            Monte Alan JACKSON
                                                                                          m. Amy MILLER
                                                                                 Alyson N. JACKSON
                                                                                 Collin B. JACKSON
                                                                                 Ryan M. JACKSON
                           Jesse Carrmon LORREN (male)
                                                   b. 14 Jul 1910  Cleburne Co., Ala
                                                   d. 18 Aug 1996 Gadsden, Etowah Co., Ala
                                                        buried Crestwood Cemetery, Gadsden, Ala
                                                   m. Genie Annette GUTHRIE
                                                                     b. 13 Mar 1931
                                                                     d. 13 Mar 1931
                                          Mary Janet LORREN
                                                                     m. Horace Ray NOAH
                                                            David Lane NOAH
                                                                                          m. Tricia TURNER
                                                                                 Kristi L. NOAH
                                                                                                                  m. Mathew ST. JOHN
                                                                                 Jared L. NOAH
                                                             Donna Lynne NOAH
                                                                                           m. Randall FOWLER
                                                                                  Randi L. FOWLER (F)
                                                            Christopher Ray NOAH
                                                                             b. 5 Feb 1966 Gadsden, Ala
                                                                                          d. 12 Jan 1987 Gadsden, Ala
                                                                                          m. Angela MCGATHA
                                          Kenneth Ray LORREN
                                                                     m. Charlotte Ann PATTY
                                          Jerry Wayne LORREN
                                                                     m. Annette POWELL
                                                            Jerri Lynn LORREN
                                          Rebecca "Becky" LORREN
                                                                     m. Dean HULSEY
                                                            Kacy Lynne HULSEY
                           Woodrow Wilson LORREN
                                                     m. (1) Frances Rebecca BUTTRAM
                                                     m. (2) Dora GIPSON
                           Shella Lou Tishie LORREN
                                                     b. 8 Apr 1915 Borden Springs, Ala
                                                     d. 16 Nov 1994 Piedmont, Ala
                                                     buried Piedmont Memory Gardens, Piedmont, Ala
                                                     m. Telles Lee HAMBY on 10 Jan 1935 Chulafiney, Ala
                                                     b. 6 Sept 1911 Morganton, NC
                                                     d. 20 Mar 1976 Piedmont, Ala
                                                     buried alongside wife
                                                     Notes: Telles was the son of John Hamby and Myrtle ?
                                            Leland Hall HAMBY
                                                            b. 3 Jan 1939 Borden Springs, Ala
                                                                         d. 3 Jan 1939 Borden Springs, Ala
                                            Marilyn Yvonne HAMBY
                                                                         m. (1) Albert Thomas MINTON
                                                                         b. 5 Jan 1941
                                                                         d. 13 Mar 1993
                                                                         m. (2) Roy Max GALLOWAY
                                                                Tammy Lynn MINTON
                                                                                                 m. Gregory Brent NORTON
                                                                                       Chadwick NORTON
                                                                                       Brittany NORTON
                                                                Michele Yvetter MINTON
                                                                                                m. Rodney WADDELL
                                                                                        Tori WADDELL
                                                                                        Kali WADDELL
                                                                Tracy Nicole MINTON
                                                                                                 m. Jonathan Wayne INGRAM
                                                                                        Mathew INGRAM
                                                                                        Samuel INGRAM
                                            Leroy HAMBY
                                                            b. aft 1900 - date and place withheld
                                                                         m. Mary Ann PARKER
                                                            b. 22 Aug 1952
                                                                         d. 7 Mar 1982
                                                                Leland Dan HAMBY
                                                                Rodney Lee HAMBY
                                                                                                m. Lisa ?
                                                                                      Marisa HAMBY
               Sidney Cruth LORREN
                               b. 1872
                                    m. Mary ?
                           James LORREN
                           Elbert LORREN
                           Pauline LORREN
               James Tilton (Tildon) LORREN (photo)
                                    b. 15 Oct 1875 (contradiction 1880 census gave age as 7)
                                    d. 14 Nov 1918 buried Borden Springs Cemetery
                                    m. Alma STUDDARD
                               Notes: James was a school teacher
                           Daisey LORREN (photo)
               Samuel Prathel LORREN (photo)
                               b. 9 Apr 1879
                                    d. 12 Nov 1940
                               m. Nancy Oleana HEDGEPETH (Nanny) (photo) (see Hedgepeth)
                                    b. 9 Mar 1882
                                    d. 17 Feb 1957
                           Jasper Tillman LORREN (photo)
                                                   b.  7 Nov 1900 Borden Springs, Ala
                                                   d.  21 Jan 1948 Cedartown, Georgia
                                                        Buried Borden Springs Cemetery
                                                   m. Christine Inez COOK (photo)
                                                   b. 8 Oct. 1919 Carrolton, Carroll Co., Georgia
                                                   d. 4 May 1977 Mobile, Alabama
                                                       Buried:  Borden Springs Cemetery
                                                                    b. 1938
                                                                    d. 1938
                                          Sue LORREN (living) (photo)
                                                                     b. withheld/Living
                                                                     m. (1) Horace Marvin HALL
                                                            Rebecca A. HALL (photo)
                                                                                          m. (1) James Robert BAKER
                                                                                 Stephanie BAKER KIVAK
                                                                                          m. (2) John J. KIVAK
                                                                                 Cassandra KIVAK
                                                                     m. (2) Bernard Pritchett
                                                                     m. (3) Thomas (Hadala) (Ryan) (photo)
                                          Kenneth LORREN (living) (photo)
                                                                     m. Nina LAYNE
                                                            Donnie LORREN
                                                            Terri LORREN
                                                                                          m. (1) John STOWE
                                                                                 Molly STOWE
                                                                                          m. (2) Ronald STRIBLIN
                                                                                 Clint STRIBLIN
                                                            Jeff LORREN
                                                                                          m. Melissa BOATNER
                                                                                 Dylan LORREN
                                                                                        4 Mitchell MORGAN
                                                                                          m. Lisa MAYHALL
                                                                                           4.1 Jessica MORGAN
                                                                                           4.2 Tyler MORGAN
                                                            Melissa LORREN
                                                                                          m. John LEDBETTER
                                                                                 Dustin LEDBETTER
                                                                                 Laurin LEDBETTER
                                          Clarence D. LORREN (living)
                           Emmit Washington LORREN
                                             b. 7 Feb 1903
                                                   d. 7 Nov 1974
                                                   m. (1) Parlee ?
                                                   b. 11 May 1907
                                                   d. 30 Dec.1933 buried Borden Springs Cemetery
                                          Cecil LORREN (Cowboy)
                                          Leon LORREN
                                                                     m. (1) Arlene ?
                                                                  d. 3 Sept. 2002
                                                           Barbara LORREN
                                                            Charlotte LORREN
                                                            Steve LORREN
                                                            Regina LORREN
                                                                     m. (2) ?__________
                                                    m. (2) ? unknown wife of Emmit believed to be the mother
                                                          of Emma Jean below.
                                           Emma Jean LORREN
                           Laura Mae LORREN
                                             b. 10 Mar 1907
                                                   d. 21 Oct 1971
                                                   buried: Borden Springs Church of Christ Church Cemetery,
                                                   Cleburne, Alabama
                                                   m. Frank McWhorter
                                          C.J. McWhorter
                                          Edwin McWhorter
                                          Faye McWhorter
                           Nellie Sue LORREN (Aunt Sudie)
                                                   b. 15 Jun 1914
                                                   d.  24 Nov 1992
                                                   m.  Edward HULSEY
                           Mattie Lee LORREN
                                                b. 17 Feb 1905
                                                   d. 9 Aug 1984
                                                   buried: Borden Springs Church of Christ Cemetery
                                                   Cleburne County, AL
                                                  m. (1) Frank LYLE
                                               b.  10 Nov 1901
                                                  d.  8 Feb 1940
                                                   buried: Borden Springs Church of Christ Cemetery
                                                   Cleburne County, AL
                                          Jessie LYLE (Jabbo)
                                                                     m. Judy ?
                                          Emmitt LYLE (Buddy)
                                         Margaret LYLE (photo)
                                                                  + ? REDDING
                                                   m. (2) ? BEECHAM
                                                         Child by Beecham's 1st Marriage: ?
                                          Jackie BEECHAM
                                          Roy BEECHAM (Twin)
                                          Troy BEECHAM (Twin)
                                          James BEECHAM
                                          Henry BEECHAM
                           Annie Lou LORREN (Aunt Dandy)
                                                   b. 12 Jun 1909 Borden Springs, Ala
                                                   m. Clarence ERWIN
                           Jasper William (Billy) LORREN (adopted child)
                                                   b. 21 Jun 1930
                                                   d. 16 Nov. 1983 buried Camp Creek Cemetery
                                                       at Muscadine
               Haley LORREN
                              b. aft 1880 (wasn't listed on 1880 census)
                                    m. ? HEAD
                           Jack HEAD
                           Richard HEAD
                                    1.1.5 6.3 Mae HEAD
                           Lou HEAD (female)
               Julie LORREN
               George "Pap" LORREN
                             Note:  If this George is the same George as listed on the
                                               1880 Census as 9 years old, then the dispute as to
                                               whether his mother was Julia or Martha is resolved.
                                                If George Pap is Julia's son then George would be
                                                the second son born to John and Julia making
                                                George number on the chart (remember,
                                                I believe John may have been married prior to
                                                Julia and had at least one child - John Breckenridge
                                                Lorren who would take the number 1 slot, making
                                                William A. Lorren - John and Julia's first born -
                                                number 2 on the chart),  Corruth as,
                                                Tilton as, Samuel as, Haley, as
                                      , and Julia   For now I will leave
                                                George as the last child.
                                          m. Rosalee WOMACK
                           Billy LORREN
                           Yogi LORREN
                           Judy LORREN
                                                4 Pansy LORREN (child by Rosalee's 1st marriage)
                                                5 Frankie LORREN (child by Rosalee's 1st marriage)
                                                6 Helen LORREN (child by Rosalee's 1st marriage)
                                                7 Johnnie LORREN (child by Rosalee's 1st marriage)
                        m. (3) Martha Jane PRICE (2nd or 3rd wife of John L.C. LORREN)
                                   b.  1882 in Alabama
                                   d.  Betw. 1950-52
                             Note:  According to Janet Lorren Noah's family recollections,
                                    the following were listed as half brothers and sisters to
                                    William A. Lorren:
                                                    1. Charlie Lorren
                                                    2. Jesse Lorren
                                                    3. Lonnie Lorren
                                                    4. Robert Lorren
                                                    5. Fred Lorren
                                                    6. Authey/Authie Lorren Studdard

                               The list of nine children of John Lorren and Martha Jane Price
                                      was supplied by Sandra Seal, a granddaughter. The 1910
                                      Cleburne County, Alabama Census lists the children and
                                      mother, Marthie age 28. From the Notes of Sandra Seal: "My
                                      grandfather, John Lorren had nine children with Martha Jane
                                      Price. He was her second husband and much older than her.
                                      I do not know whom she married the first time, but she had a
                                      daughter by her first husband. I don't know who raised this
                                      child or her name. I don’t know if she lived with her dad or
                                      my grandmother and grandfather. My dad said that she was
                                      murdered when she was a young woman. He said a man cut
                                      her throat [I] never asked my dad if he grew up with her
                                      so I don''t know if he actually knew her. All that I know about
                                      my grandfather’s first wife was that she died and Mr. Lorren
                                      had several sons by her. They were grown when John and
                                      Martha got married. In fact, the story goes that my
                                      grandmother was very pretty and some of Mr. Lorren’ s
                                      sons had tried to date her before she married my
                                      grandfather".   According to the Census, J. L. C. Lorren
                                      was living alone at the age of 51, probably between

                Warner LORREN
                              m. Emma HEDGEPETH (HEDGEPETH #
                              m. Nellie RIPLEY
                                    Children: (birth order unknown)
                            Lorene LORREN (photo)
                            Kathlene LORREN (photo)
               Charlie Arthur LORREN
                                b.  1902
                                      d.  1992
                                      m. Cecilia "Cecil" ?
                             Ann LORREN
                             Polly LORREN
               Authie\Authey LORREN
                                      b.  1904 in Ala
                                      d.  shortly after having a baby and her husband
                                           raised the children somewhere around
                                           Piedmont, Ala
                                      m. Milt STUDDARD
         Lonnie LORREN
                                      b. 1905 in Ala.
                                      Note:  Lonnie disappeared shortly after he left the Army.
                                                 He left an unnamed wife and two children
                                                 Some researchers believe he was murdered
               Robert "Rob" LORREN
                                      b. 1907 Ala.
               Jesse H. LORREN
                                      b. 1907/08 Ala
                                      d. 1992
                                      m. Elvie Mae JACOBS
                                Note:  In the Polk County Georgia Death Records for
                                                1951-1965, Georgia Court of Ordinary, Index to
                                                Death Certificates, Book B, a Elvie Jacobs Lorrens
                                                died 14 Nov 1964 due to Arteriosclerotic heart disease.
                             Jessie Joyce LORREN
                                          b. 1939
                                                       d. 1993
                                                       m. Frank VINES
                                              Frank Lawayne VINES
                                              David Bryant VINES
                              Sandra Gail LORREN
                                                        m. Elias Jefferson SEAL, Jr.
                                               Terrie SEAL
                                                                            m. David OWENS
                                               Gretchen SEAL
                                               Jeffery Lorren SEAL
          Fred LORREN
                                Note:  believed Fred died at a young age of typhoid fever.
                                                 believed to be buried at Shiloh Church
               Jeff LORREN
                                      d. abt. 1959
               Woodrow LORREN
                                      d. as an infant; buried at Mountain Creek Church
           1.1.6 Sarah LORREN (dau George A. LORREN)
                     b. abt 1851 (1870 Cenus gives age 19)
           1.1.7 Martha "Mattie" Deborah LORREN (more info at Payne Daniel's web site)
               b. 9 Dec 1853 Ala or Georgia
                     d. 8 May 1921 Carrol County, Ga
                         buried Antioch Baptist Church Cemetery
                     m. James Wesley KILGORE 21 Mar 1875 in Cleburne Co., Ala
                     b.  7 Feb 1853 in Ala
                     d. 5 Jun 1936 in Carrol County, Ga
                         buried Antioch Baptist Church Cemetery
            Almeda (Meadie) KILGORE
                    b.  15 Aug 1878 Ala
                                 d. 14 Jan 14, 1967 Carrol County, Ga
                                      buried Antioch Baptist Church Cemetery
                                 m. J. William (Will) WEBB 10 Sept 1899, Cleburne co., Ala
                                 b. 10 Mar 1879 Ala
                                 d. 5 June 1963 Carrol County, Ga
                                     buried Antioch Baptish Church Cemetery
            John Lyrie KILGORE
                                 b. 13 Dec 1880, Muscadine, Ala
                                 d. 14 Dec 1963 Carrollton, Ga
                                     buried at Old Camp Methodist Church
            Rosa Ann KILGORE
                    b. 01 Apr 1883, Ala
                                 d. 21 Aug 1967, Carrol County, Ga
                                     buried at Old Camp Methodist Church
            Ellen B. KILGORE
                    b. 08 Aug 1885
                                 d. 04 July 1976, Providence, Ala
                                     buried at Providence Church Cemetery
                                 m. Robert J.W. FINCHER 10 Feb 1924 Carrol Co., Ga
                                 b. 01 Nov 1871
                                 d. 08 May 1954 Woodland, Ala
            Criscro W. KILGORE
                                 b. 03 Apr 1887
                                 d. July 12, 1925, Ranburne, Ala
                                 m. Susie SMITH 02 Nov 1913 Carrol Co., Ga
                                 b. 30 Jan 1893
                                 d. 12 Oct 1975 Ranburne, Ala
            Jackson H. (Jack) KILGORE
                                 b. ? Mar 1891
            James Jethro KILGORE
                                 b. 19 Aug 1897
                                 d. 07 May 1966, Fulton Co.
                                     buried Antioch Baptist Church, Carrol Co., Ga
             1.1.8 James LORREN
             1.1.9 Elizabeth LORREN
             1.1.10 Thomas Shermon LORREN
                      b. 4 Feb 1863/65
                        d. 12 Sept 1928 Haralson, Ga
                             buried Philadephia Baptist Cemetery Calhoun Co., Ala
                        m. Sarah Ellen FORRESTER 30 Dec 1886 Haralson Co., Ga
                        b. 14 Dec 1865 Cherokee Co., NC
                        d. 18 Sept 1934 Calhoun Co., Ala
                        Notes:  appears on 1870, 1880 Cleburne Co., Ala Census and 1900 Polk
                                    County, Ala Census; Sarah was the dau of John Coleman Forrester
                                    and Martha "Louisa" HART
               Pearlie LORREN
            1.1.11 Missouri LORREN (photo) (photo)
                       m. James Martin (J.M.) BARNES 15 Aug 1886 Cleburne Co., Ala
                       Notes:  Payne Daniel has a copy of the marriage license
              Nancy Lou Vennie BARNES
                                    m. John Marion Luther LORREN ( above) (1st cousin)
                                     (see children under above)
                                  2 Lyman BARNES  (by J.M's marriage to Cornelia VEAZEY)
                                  3 James C. BARNES (by J.M's marriage to Cornelia VEAZEY)
                                  4 Ida BARNES (by J.M's marriage to Cornelia VEAZEY)
                                  5 Sara BARNES (by J.M.'s marriage to Cornelia VEAZEY)
                                  6. Robert B. BARNES (by J.M.'s marriage to Cornelia VEAZEY)
            1.1.12  George S. LORREN
                        Note:  Listed as son on 1870 Census and 1 year old
     1.2 John LORREN/LAURIN
           m. ? GLASCOCK
     1.3 Jarncia/Jerusha LORREN/LAURIN
           b. Ala. 1822

Questions regarding the parentage of James B. Lorren (married Jerri Ann Knighten) came up during my correspondence regarding the parentage of James B. Lorren (married Jerri Ann Knighten) with Payne Daniels.  I am including a portion of that correspondence just in case someone out there can help resolve the issues.  The correspondence:

Payne Daniels asked: "Do you ignore the 1910 census that list James the son of George A. as being born in 1860-61, with the correct dates for his sibs? What is your reference for a DOB for the James Lorren that you have listed for George A. as 1854?"

My answer: "I don't have the 1910 census so I'm going on your review of it... so here are the lists as to how it would work...but first, I took James' (son of George A.) birth date from LDS birth record which contradicts the 1910 census...but ignoring that it leaves us with the following reasoning:

     1.  If the census has a James (son of George A. listed (and not to confuse George A. father
          and George L. son) living with father George in 1910 with a birth of abt. 1860 he would
          be living with dad at the age of abt. 60...that brings up the questions:

                i. why was James living with dad and not with wife Jerri (Annie) Knighten Lorren (who
                   was alive for the 1910 census) in their own home?
               ii.  LDS did not list any children for this James...and I do not know of any, this could
                   explain why James was still living with dad George A. at the 1910 census BUT we
                   know that our J.B. and Jerri Ann had at least 12 children by the 1910 census.
                   Were those children listed as a part of George A's household in the 1910 census?
                   The children would be (as given by J.B. Lorren's g-grandson):

                            1. Mary (Mollie) Lorren (b. 1881)
                            2.  George Lorren (b. 1884)
                            3.  James (Bill) Wright Lorren (b. 1885)
                            4.  Sarah Ellen Lorren (b. 1888)
                            5.  John Marion Luther (father to J.B. Lorren that gave me info) (b. 1890)
                            6.  Julia L. (Rosie) Lorren (b. 1896)
                            7.  Lula A. Lorren (b. 1896) (twin of Julia)
                            8.  Lillie Mae Lorren (b. 1899)
                            9.  Estellea Lorren (b. 1901)
                          10.  Louella Lorren (b. 1901) (twin of Estellea)
                          11.  Thomas (Tom) Lorren (b. 1904)
                          12.  Alex B. Lorren (b. 1907)

                   I don't know where J.B. and Jerri were living when the children were born other
                   than JB and Jerri married in 1875 in Esom Hill, GA...and the story infers JB and
                   Jerri were living in or near Esom...we need to check census records for that area
                   to locate (if possible) Jerri and JB...

     iii.  This James  (son of George A.) is listed in the 1870 census but not the 1860 census,
           which would be a conflict with LDS birth record of 1854 and a pro for James (son of
           George A.) being our J.B. Lorren.


     iv.  J.B. Lorren (the alive grandson of James B. and Jerri Knighten) stated his grandmother
           Jerri married her "half" brother...this would pose a conflict in that George A.'s son
           James would be Jerri's "uncle" - hard to confuse the two words...BUT, it could be
           possible since George A.'s son James would have been 3 yrs. old right after Jerri
           was born in 1863, and they could have grown up together and married.

     v.  The following is a verbatim email sent to me by Martha McFarland (daughter to living
          J.B.) (and also where I came across the other two names - John and Tom) and where
          I came up with the first *unknown to me* wife theory....Martha wrote:

                  "Attached is a picture of Julia Ann Pollard - born 3-20-1839 & died 08-06-1899
                  and John L. C. Lorren - not sure of date of birth (maybe 1847) died in 1931.  He
                  was married to an unknown woman before Julia Ann Pollard.  He had at least 4
                  children by this unknown woman: John, Tom, James Breckenridge (born
                  12-01-1860 died 10-12-1922), and Lubie. Lubie married James Barnes and
                  had a daughter Nancy Lou Vennie Barnes who later married John Marion Lorren
                 who was the son of Jerri Ann Elevelton Knighten and James Breckenridge Lorren.

                  John L.C. Lorren and Julia Ann Pollard were married after 1863 and had the
                  following children: Samuel Prathel Lorren, Carruth Lorren, James Tilton Lorren,
                  Haley Lorren, Warner Lorren, Mattie Lorren and Julie Lorren (NOTE: these
                  names were written in John and Julia's Family Bible; it is not clear
                  whether all these children were by Julia or by Martha as birth dates
                  were not listed.)

                  Prior to marrying John L. C. Lorren, Julia Ann Pollard married Jeremiah Knighten
                  on August 26, 1857.  Jeremiah Knighten was born 12-09-1828 and died
                  05-03-1863, Julia Ann Pollard and Jeremiah Knighten had the following known

                              1.   Sarah A. Knighten
                              2.   Thomas Wright Knighten, and
                              3.   William Alex Knighten

                   Jeremiah's first wife was Julia Ann Pollard's sister - Mandy Pollard.  They had
                   one known child: John L. Knighten. (email from Martha Lorren Razer McFarlin,
                   daughter of J.B. Lorren and Mary Elizabeth Dixon Lorren)

                   MY NOTE (see Knighten page):
                                     Jeremiah Knighten
                                     m. #1 Amanda (Mandy) POLLARD m. 1849
                                               1. John Littleton KNIGHTEN
                             2.  Malissa A. KNIGHTEN (m. Wesley GIBSON)
                             3  George Wright KNIGHTEN (b. 9 Apr 1852
                                     m. #2  Emily JACKSON 7 Feb 1856 Benton Co., AL
                                                (see marriage certificate transcription)
                                     m. #3  Julia Ann POLLARD B. 20 Mar 1838 D. 6 Aug 1899
                                                 m. 26 Aug 1857 in Cleburne Co., AL
                                                (see marraige certificate transcription)
                                                (see Pollard Julia Ann POLLARD)

     vi.  If John L.C. Lorren was born (according to family) betw 1848/1850, he would have
          married Julia Pollard Knighten when he was 15/17 respectively...at that age we would
          have to assume that he married an unknown person and had the three children as
          written above; but, even having 3 children back to back, have unknown wife #1 die,
          and turn around and marry Julia would mean John L.C. would have had to marry this
          unknown first wife at abt. 10 or 12 yrs. old....ON THE OTHER HAND, if John L.C. was
          born in 1840 as LDS records state, then John L.C. would have been abt. 23 years
          old when he married Julia Pollard Knighten...and this would be enough time to
          marry and sire 3 to 5 children by an unknown first wife.

So, if the LDS records are accurate to birth for John L.C. then it is possible that:

     1.  John LC was born in 1840, married unknown, had four children,
          and then married Julia at 23 and it would be plausibe that  J.B. Lorren
          married *half* sister Jerri...Information backing this would be JB (living)'s
          family record as related above, LDS birth record for John L.C. as 1840,
          and to include the fact that we have not found any known descendents
          for the James living with George A. in 1910 census, but we do have children
          for Jerri and JB...so

Note 1: Polk County  Georgia Death Records 1951-1965 Georgia Court of Ordinary, Index to Death Certificates - Book B, for the years 1951 through 1965.

Note 2: Mildred Perry was kind enough to write me to relate the following information, "There were two Lula Lorrens, one born in 1898 and one born in 1903.  The 1898 Lula Lorren is the one who was the daughter of James Breckenridge Lorren who married Jerri Eveleton Knighten.  This Lula Lorren married my mother's brother, Monroe Thomason...and they had two children, Gladys Thomason Green and Joseph Robert Thomason.  Monroe and Lula lived at Esom Hill and after his tragic death at age 34, Lula lived in Cedartown until she married a Mr. Hindmon.  Following WWII, Joseph Robert Thomason moved to Puxico, Missouri and lived there until his death. Gladys Green lived in Cedartown, and Macon, Georgia where she died....Monroe's death was self-inflicted when he was drunk and playing with guns, which was one of his favorite pasttimes.  He was laughing and jesting, and placed a pistol in each ear while looking in a mirror, and the coroner's report says the guns went off accidentally.  I feel sure Monroe did not mean to kill himself.  To tell a very sad aspect of his death, my Mother, his sister, always felt that his wife, Lula, killed him.  Monroe was a sadistic, violent ignoramous and probably, as much as I hate to say it, got what he deserved.  He was brutal to his wife and children and my mother.  His death was no great loss, sad to relate.  Becky, I am sorry to regale you with such a sorry tale...."

Note 3: Jeffery Scott HOPPER (great grandson of Lillie Mae Lorren contacted me May 27, 2002 and has graciously agreed to share his family information and research.  Jeff can be emailed at: [email protected]  He wrote: "Lillie Mae Lorren was my great grandmother.  I spent a great deal of my childhood at her house.  She told me many things about her family.  First of all, I would like to provide info on her husband.  His name was James Avery Alfred WADDELL....Her maternal grandmother lived with her family and died while she was still a child.  She named her Lillie Mae and always called her "'Sweet Lillie Mae"'....Her maternal grandfather was killed in the war between the states.  She said that "'the Yankees had stuffed a logging-chain into a cannon and fired it striking her grandfather at the knees amputating both legs.  He lived long enough to write his wife a letter."'  Her brother, Tommie, went out west and was murdered.  He was hit on the head."  Then in another email Jeff wrote: "My great-grandmother, Lillie Mae Lorren, was the daughter of James "Jim" Breckinridge Lorren and Jerry Ann "Annie" Knighten.  Her children were James E.J. WADDELL, my grandfather, and Avery R.C. WADDELL.  My grandfather passed away, but R.C. is still living....sorry to say she never mentioned her Lorren grandparents (that I recall).  She had told me that her father (Jim) worked as a blacksmith at times...."

Note 4:  According to Payne Daniel, "William Aaron Lorren was an elder in the church of Christ and a schoolteacher. His granddaughter, Janet Noah, states her grandfather was born on September 1, 1870 and died April 22, 1947.  He married Cathren Abney who was born on December 29, 1875 and died April 28, 1956.  There were eleven children all of whom had children except Virgil who died at the age of 2 or 3 years. Janet's grandfather told her that his grandfather or great-grandfather was French and married a Cherokee Indian Girl.  He told her that his family moved to Alabama from Missouri in a covered wagon when he was nine months old, to escape a typhoid outbreak. (While the movement from MO to AL is doubtless true, the French connection is probably a myth).   Toni Carolyn/Baswell/Tierce says that her grandmother was part Native American perhaps a Cherokee. They settled in Borden Springs, Ala.  When he was a young man he and his father built a one room school/church near Borden Springs, Alabama and he taught school during the week and preached on Sundays.  From Janet: "Granddaddy Lorren performed weddings during his preaching days.  At that time, the State of Alabama required marriage licenses but Georgia did not.   Since Borden Springs was about four miles from the Georgia line, many couples would pick up Granddaddy and drive across the state line.  They would get out of the car and he would marry them in the middle of the road.  Uncle Newton Lorren and Aunt Ruby were probably married in this way."

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